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Post by Pam & Dobby on Oct 10, 2013 20:20:03 GMT -7
Pretty good day. I can tell that crate rest will get more challenging as he continues to feel better.
We have an appointment on Monday with the vet who does acupuncture, etc. Have out-of-town guests arriving tomorrow. I hope they can understand how important the crate rest is. Dobby was a real spit-fire and a snuggle-bunny when they were here 6 months ago.
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Post by Pauliana on Oct 10, 2013 21:56:46 GMT -7
Hi Pam,
Good luck with the house guests during crate rest. We had Neil's grandson overnight while Tyler was on crate rest and Cody was a good boy and respected the crate rest but he wanted to pet him and we let him only when we were right there..
Just explain the rules to them and that it's for Dobby's sake. Hopefully they will respect that.. : )
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Post by Pam & Dobby on Oct 11, 2013 7:14:18 GMT -7
I think that they will respect the rules. They will just change the energy in the house & I'm a little concerned about how excited and/or agitated Dobby might get. I will talk to the vet & also try to find this in the lit, but is there anything that I can give him that will take the edge off or sedate him just a little? I think the vet mentioned something earlier, but he had a stretch of feeling so poorly that we didn't need it. The good news is that he is feeling better. The challenge is going to be not letting him get too agitated about having to stay in the crate. I have borrowed a pen, but not sure how easy it will be to set it up & have room for extra people to be moving around.
He is definitely wanting to walk. Taking a couple of steps but back legs can't quite work it out. Wobbly, knuckling, etc. Also, he is barking & alert to surroundings. NOTE: I don't think benedryl works for him. Also, we have to be extra careful about drug interactions due to his epilepsy and phenobarbital.
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Post by Linda Stowe on Oct 11, 2013 9:13:35 GMT -7
Hi Pam
Good news that he is feeling better and trying to walk. Since he has epilepsy and Benedryl doesn't work for him, I would call the vet and see if there is anything they can suggest. There are some calmers on the market, but I'm even hesitant to recommend these with his other meds. Maureen's Stevie is on epilepsy drugs and she might have a recommendation for you.
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StevieLuv
Helpful Member
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Post by StevieLuv on Oct 11, 2013 9:59:59 GMT -7
These are some oral calmers that might work out - Stevie is such a couch potato (now cushion on the floor potato) that we never had to use them... Oral calmers: 1) ANXITANE® S chewable tabs contain 50 mg L-Theanine, an amino acid that acts neurologically to help keep dogs calm, relaxed www.virbacvet.com/products/detail/anxitane-l-theanine-chewable-tablets/behavioral-health 2) Composure Soft Chews are colostrum based like calming mother's milk and contain 21 mg of L-Theanine. www.vetriscience.com/composure-soft-dogs-MD-LD.php [Composure] 3) Rescue Remedy is a liquid herb combo to help with relaxation www.bachrescueremedypet.comI did a bit of research to see if there were any drug interactions with phenobarb, and they all said that there were no known interactions. Check with your Vet to be doubly sure, and if you are looking at other herbal calmers watch out for those contain Kava - like Happy Traveler - this one DOES interact with phenobarb.
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Post by Pam & Dobby on Oct 12, 2013 12:24:43 GMT -7
Dobby is taking some steps today. Wobbly, but sniffed out a preferred poop spot.
I have some Rescue Remedy to try. If that doesn't help, I will look into the others mentioned. Thanks for the info!
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Post by Pam & Dobby on Oct 13, 2013 16:47:42 GMT -7
Another good day. Dobby seems more himself every day. Will see holistic vet tomorrow. I know it will still take a few weeks to let him continue to recover, regain his strength, etc. Is there a standard or typical way to wean off of pain meds?
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PaulaM
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Member since 2007: surgery, conservative . Montana, USA
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Post by PaulaM on Oct 13, 2013 18:18:40 GMT -7
Keep the good news coming…. so wonderful to hear!
Prednisone taper ends with an every other day dose. The adrenal glands are signaled to start making their own steroid hormone, cortisol, again via the every other day dose.
If steroids are suddenly stopped, the body may not have enough cortisol stores from the adrenal glands to support critical metabolic functions of the body.
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Post by Pam & Dobby on Oct 14, 2013 19:05:33 GMT -7
The vet was very encouraged with Dobby's progress today. He had his first acupuncture treatment.
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Post by Pauliana on Oct 14, 2013 20:37:31 GMT -7
Very happy to hear that Dobby is doing so well and the Vet is encouraged. Acupuncture will do him a lot of good too.
Healing thoughts and prayers..
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Post by Pam & Dobby on Oct 16, 2013 5:53:15 GMT -7
It is hard to believe that it has been 3 weeks since I first took Dobby to the vet with what we now know is IVDD.
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StevieLuv
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Post by StevieLuv on Oct 16, 2013 6:32:30 GMT -7
You have learned an awful lot in the past 3 weeks
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Post by Pam & Dobby on Oct 18, 2013 19:09:54 GMT -7
After several days of improving every day, Dobby did not take many steps yesterday. I thought it might be because it was wet and raining off & on. He has never liked to go out in that kind of weather. Today was sunny. He did take a few steps when I encouraged him but did not just eagerly walk like he had for the previous few days. I have to remember that even without this going on, some days are better than others. Also, routine was different for several days due to having house guests + the acupuncture vet visit. One day at a time.
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Post by Pam & Dobby on Oct 19, 2013 9:03:53 GMT -7
Today Dobby is better so far. Walked to his preferred poop spot & then walked back to the door. Wobbly, but did not fall. I did not notice any knuckling. I have to remember to be very patient. He may stand in the spot where I put him down for a while before deciding to do anything. On Monday we will have the 2nd appointment with the vet who does acupuncture. Hope I can find someone to walk the terriers during that time.
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StevieLuv
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Post by StevieLuv on Oct 19, 2013 9:57:19 GMT -7
Good to hear that Dobby is feeling better. Remember to restrict his potty time to as few steps as possible - it would be safer to carry him to his potty spot, and then back to his crate, rather than letting him walk. He has come so far, and you don't want a set-back now. Keep us posted
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Post by Pam & Dobby on Oct 19, 2013 14:18:45 GMT -7
Thank you. I definitely do not want a set-back! I carry him to some of his spots but he sometimes wants to go to a different one. In either case, I'm just talking about a few steps. Only a few steps when he walked back to the door & then I carried him in. I thought I had understood from the holistic vet that I should allow him to walk a little, supervised on his leash, just during brief potty periods.
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Marjorie
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Post by Marjorie on Oct 19, 2013 18:34:25 GMT -7
The most important thing you can do for Dobby is to restrict the movement of his spine, Pam. The recovery suite acts as a cast and by keeping the spine as still as possible, that's what allows a scar to form over the injured disc. And it takes 8 weeks to do that. Carried in and out to potty, with as few steps as possible to do his business. If he's walking to a different spot, then you might want to try what others have found to be helpful - make a small potty area with push-in-the-ground plastic fencing. That helps restrict them to one spot and they soon learn to do their business there. It's wonderful that he's able to walk without knuckling and I know you want to see what he's able to do, but it's best not to encourage him to walk right now. Too much movement can re-tear the disc and you're back to square one. There's a video on this page that helps explain how the disc damages the spinal cord: www.dodgerslist.com/literature/healingpage.htmHe's doing great, Pam, and I'm very happy for both of you!
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Post by Pam & Dobby on Oct 21, 2013 5:27:39 GMT -7
Dobby's crate was urine soaked this morning. I took him out immediately and he pooped & seemed OK. I hope that it was just an accident. He has been good at letting me know when he needs to go out and I always take him out first thing in the morning. As long as he urinates on his own later in the day, should I be concerned? I wasn't sure about the best way to clean him. Suggestions? We have 2nd session with holistic vet today.
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Post by Jean & Mimi on Oct 21, 2013 6:03:05 GMT -7
Pam, if he is wet, I would wipe him down with a moist washcloth right away. This weekend I gave Mimi a "bath" with green tea. I made a pot of green tea and let it cool. Then I took a washcloth and soaked it and wiped her down in her crate. I did it right before potty time so that hubs could pick her up and I could make sure I got her undercarriage. She has control of her bladder, so the only time she gets pee on her is when she submissive pee's and rolls on her back then it gets on her rear leg and tail. But she was getting a little bit stinky as she hasn't had a bath in a while. THe green tea was a recommendation from someone here and it was kind of nice. She smelled a little bit like the tea for a while. But then it faded then she just smelled fresh. HOpe this helps.
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Marjorie
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Post by Marjorie on Oct 21, 2013 7:01:45 GMT -7
Hopefully, it was just a one time accident, Pam. Keep a close eye on it, though, and if you see more wet bedding or if he leaks when being picked up, please immediately contact your vet to let them know and to get a hands on your hands demonstration on how to express his bladder. Don't let that go too long as any urine remaining in the bladder can breed a urinary infection or the bladder can stretch out of shape if allowed to overflow.
Take him to a favorite spot where he usually pees, let him sniff and see if he can release urine on his own. Please let us know how he does the rest of the day.
Blessings to you both.
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PaulaM
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Post by PaulaM on Oct 21, 2013 7:14:11 GMT -7
Pam, it helps to understand the order of neuro functions, so you do not needlessly worry. As damage to the spinal cord would increase, there is a predictable order of deterioration. You may want to print out the list from this page: www.dodgerslist.com/literature/healingsurgery.htmThis is a handy page to print for your fridge so the whole family knows how to recognize an emergency. www.dodgerslist.com/literature/FridgeInfo81907.pdfLet us know that even though Dobby should not be allowed to walking around, that he can still take a very few permissible footsteps at potty time.
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Post by Pam & Dobby on Oct 21, 2013 11:41:00 GMT -7
Thank you all for the info and suggestions. I did wipe his underside and legs with a damp washcloth when I took him out of the crate this morning, but I may try the green tea later. I have taken him out 2x and he has pee'd on his own. He just had his 2nd acupuncture treatment. The holistic vet wants to start him on the following immediately: - vitamin E - 100 IU 1x day - Selenium - 100mcg 1x day
and a Chinese herb "Hindquarter Weakness" -- probably next week Anyone have any experience with these supplements? Know of any potential adverse reactions or drug interactions? I will look them up, but always like input from people who have had first-hand experience. He is currently taking phenobarbital 16.2mg 2x day for epilepsy. Also, he is on: Tramadol 25mg 3x day Methocarbamol 1/4 of 500mg tablet 3x day Vet wants to reduce the methocarbamol to 2x day, starting today. Note: We had to stop the prednisone after only 3-4 days due to extreme GI reaction, in spite of using Pepcid and Sucralfate. Pepcid and Sucralfate have been stopped also.
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PaulaM
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Member since 2007: surgery, conservative . Montana, USA
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Post by PaulaM on Oct 21, 2013 18:39:01 GMT -7
So glad you will be looking up the active ingredients for the herbs. Chinese Herbs are composed of many herbs in one bottle/pill, meaning you will need to Google each one to familiarize yourself on what your dog is taking. I would be hesitant with Chinese Herbs if your dog has allergies or is taking any conventional prescription drugs. There can be possible negative reactions between prescription meds and Chinese herbs.
Let us know if you are now or see in the next days signs of pain resurfacing…. pain = swelling and the need to be back on pain meds.
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Post by Pam & Dobby on Oct 24, 2013 6:53:23 GMT -7
4 weeks down. Methocarbamol reduced to 2x day for the past 3 days and have not noticed any signs of pain. No pain, eat/pee/poop regularly. Walking improving -- just a few steps when out to potty. Have not started any of the supplements. Have had difficulty finding the Vit E and Selenium in the recommended strengths in a reputable brand. Also, not sure I'm on board with the Chinese herbs, especially since Dobby is epileptic (but doing well) and has a sensitive GI system. Disappointed that holistic vet has not returned my call from Tuesday to discuss supplements further, but I'd rather err on the side of caution before adding anything. Will keep next acupuncture appointment on Monday, but may have to weigh cost/benefit of continuing beyond that. Budget is very stretched, but I am thankful and happy with the progress Dobby has made.
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Post by Jean & Mimi on Oct 24, 2013 7:02:28 GMT -7
Awesome news!!!! So glad he is doing so well He will heal on his own without the accupuncture so if you need to stop, know you have already done soooo much for him.
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Marjorie
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Post by Marjorie on Oct 24, 2013 7:05:27 GMT -7
That's a very good update, Pam! Excellent that you haven't seen any signs of pain during the taper. And Dobby's walking has improved, too! Yes, I agree with you that you should be cautious about adding the Chinese herbs. It's so hard to know what's in them and how they will react to other medications. As for the acupuncture, you are already doing the best treatment possible for Dobby - the strict crate rest. Keep up the good work!
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Post by Pam & Dobby on Oct 24, 2013 10:59:08 GMT -7
Two food-related questions: Once Dobby has finished the crate rest, any recommendations for doxie-sized elevated bowl(s)? Most of the small ones I have seen are not elevated enough, if at all, and others are just way too big. Also, will he need to continue to eat soft / soaked / or canned food? He was mostly getting dry kibble before and I checked it on one of the dodgerslist pages and it got a good rating.
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Post by Jean & Mimi on Oct 24, 2013 11:06:50 GMT -7
Ok, before she got sick, Mimi ate only dry kibble too. I have been soaking it too because she is more likely to eat it. I think we have to see if our dogs will go back to the kibble after they have been spoiled rotten lol.
Amazon seems to offer quite a few raised feeding stations. Some are for small dogs too. Check there.
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StevieLuv
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Post by StevieLuv on Oct 24, 2013 11:06:56 GMT -7
He should be able to go back to his normal food - though some of them still love (demand!) the soft and soaked kibble, so it may be a gradual reintroduction to the regular food. Small and elevated bowls are hard to find. You can try the small bowls with the rubber grippy ring on the bottom, that is then placed up on a block of some sort. Here, the high school metal work shop is often looking for ideas to challenge the students, check out your local high school, maybe a student would be willing to create a stand for his bowls, for the cost of the materials.
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Post by Pam & Dobby on Oct 25, 2013 14:05:54 GMT -7
Had a phone consult with the holistic vet. She is very pleased with Dobby's progress. Since 4 days with reduced Methocarbamol have gone OK with no signs of pain, we will also cut the Tramadol down to 1x every 12 hrs. starting today. Also, starting today, will be adding Vitamin E and Selenium (given with food). Will be keeping a close eye on any signs of pain or regression of progress. Also, any signs of GI upset with the addition of the supplements. Tramadol 25mg every 12 hrs. Methocarbamol 1/4 of 500 mg tab every 12 hrs. Phenobarbital 16.2 mg every 12 hrs. (for epilepsy) Vitamin E 100 IU 1x day with food Selenium 100 mcg 1x day with food We have acupuncture appointment on Monday afternoon & will assess his status then. If all has continued to go well, will schedule following appt. for 2 weeks later. This afternoon Dobby held his foot up while he pee'd -- the whole time! Did not fall. His walk is still very wobbly and occasionally he sort of falls to the side or into a kind of sit but pops right back up on his own. I have not been using the rear sling as much because he only barely tolerated it when he was less mobile. Sometimes would not "do business" unless I slid it off. Of course, walking is still very limited and only when out for potty break. Still, makes me
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