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Post by Marissa & Rosie on Nov 19, 2024 7:38:49 GMT -7
[Original subject line: Rosie - 13 years old - surgery on 11/17 ] Hello, The love of our lives and glue of our family jumped off the couch [11/16] yesterday and lost the use of her back legs. I will never, ever forgive myself for letting her jump down. She immediately took Her to the emergency vet. They did an MRI and say a bulging disc which they then removed via surgery (I may have the terms wrong). Before she went in, they said she had some feeling in one of her legs. With that in mind, they said she has an 85% chance of walking again. We have a three year old boy and 2 month old. Any advice on how we can support her when she gets home would be so greatly appreciated. Rosie has supported us through the most difficult times. We love her beyond ability to put into words! We are a mess about this. I get to go see her in a few hours. I’m bringing her favorite foods (cucumbers and pumpkin). ★1 She weighs 16 lbs. She is given half of a prion chew [Proin] In the morning because the vet thought she might have a weak pelvic floor and as leaking - which caused her to lick her parts a lot. ★2 We were told by the rescue organization that Rosie a purebread mini doxie and is 12-13 years old. We rescued her from a terrible situation where she was abused and starved. When we got her she was 7ish years old and weighed 6lbs. My name is Marissa. ★3 Yes - yesterday [11/18?] she went down and had an MRI and then surgery. ★4 date of surgery? 11/17The hallmark component of conservative treatment is the crate rest part. With little blood supply discs are much slower to form good scar tissue than it takes a blood rich broken bone to heal. That 6 weeks of a cast for a broken arm to heal is similar to the recovery suite being a kind of cast for the disc. 100% STRICT crate rest 24/7 for 8 weeks provides limited movement to allow good strong scar tissue to form.
Super tried and true tips for setting up the recovery suite: dodgerslist.com/2020/05/14/strict-rest-recovery-process/
STRICT means: - no laps - no couches - no baths - no sleeping with you - no chiro therapy - no dragging or meandering at potty times.
POTTY TIMES Carry to and from the recovery suite to the potty place and then allow a very few limited footsteps. Using a sling (long winter scarf, ace bandage, belt) will save your back and help to keep a wobbly dog's back aligned and butt from tipping over. A harness and 6 foot leash is to control speed and keep footsteps to minimum as you stand in one spot. An ex-pen in the grass is an excellent alternative to minimizing footsteps with the physical and visual to indicate there will be no sniff festing going on!★6 I’m not sure - she’s at the vet still ★7 She has very limited ability to use her back legs immediately after surgery which they say is to be expected. We are hopeful she will get more mobility back as we work with her. ★8 bladder control I don’t know yet.
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PaulaM
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Member since 2007: surgery, conservative . Montana, USA
Posts: 19,941
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Post by PaulaM on Nov 19, 2024 11:07:30 GMT -7
Welcome Marissa! We are glad you are here. you have reported some good news. With the ability to move her back legs ... there is great potential for nerve repair to take place with time! What date was the Proin first prescribed for leaking urine? You will want to get Rosie's recovery suite set up and waiting for her on discharge day. Also, you would want to ready yourself with all the questions that are coming to mind to make sure each one gets answered on the exciting discharge day. DISCHARGE DAY I bet your mind is flooded right now with concerns, questions. Now is the time to jot those things down. Here's a starter list of questions to which you can add some of your concerns to ask your surgeon: dodgerslist.com/discharge-day-list/ This page is good reading by Dr. Isaacs, ACVIM (neurology) as he explains many post-op questions for our IVDD community: meds, crate rest, PT and discharge day. dodgerslist.com/dr-isaacs-surgery-answers/See if there are any other things you can do to make post-op crate rest go smoother with these very useful tips and ideas which include how to set up the mattress for easy maintenance:
Depending on what kind of recovery suite you have here are some ideas: --- a wire crate. Some owners find a top opening one is easier to get the dog in and out of. Here is a excellent and easy way to modify your crate to a top opening one: 🚩 dodgerslist.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/05/crate-top-conversion.pdf--- An 8-panel wire ex-pen is not only an excellent recovery suite, as a 2nd option if you find two locations would best suit your house (your bedroom and one in the living room).
And after the post-op crate rest has ended, the ex-pen can be used to block off danger areas for Rosie. The panels can be detached to fit protection needs for Rosie. As you get updates from the hospital and have time, please do let us know how Rosie is doing and what the Neuro says.
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Post by Marissa & Rosie on Nov 19, 2024 11:15:13 GMT -7
Thank you so much for the information an videos! I have read several of your threads! This is incredibly helpful during a very scary and sad situation! I was able to just go sit with her for a few hours and while she is VERY drugged, she seems OKAY.
She started PRION abt three months ago. Do you think that could have contributed to this?
Thank you so much!
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PaulaM
Moderator.
Member since 2007: surgery, conservative . Montana, USA
Posts: 19,941
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Post by PaulaM on Nov 19, 2024 12:18:08 GMT -7
It was very likely the stress of jumping down that damaged a prematurely aged disc which in turn affected the spinal cord nerves. Shortcut thru IVDD is a useful presentation to get the big picture about a disc episode when a dog was born with Intervertebral Disc Disease (IVDD). Recommended you look when you have time: dodgerslist.com/time-and-ivdd/Thank you for the update. We are very interested in Rosie and look forward to your next update and any questions that may pop into your mind.
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Post by Marissa & Rosie on Nov 20, 2024 16:49:38 GMT -7
Hello! We got to see Rosie again today! She will be released tomorrow and we are both excited and nervous to have her home!
The vet has a lot of hope that she can walk. She feels deep pain in both legs. She can somewhat stand on her own. She can poop on her own and mostly clear her bladder. We are preparing to express her but also hope she regains full function of her bladder.
We have two recovery zones set up. I also have a bassinet [?] stroller because I think eventually she’s going to want to be everywhere we are (specifically everywhere I am and food is 😂)
I am very nervous abt how we will be able to support her. We also have a newborn and a three year old so it’s going to be challenging to keep everyone happy and healthy but as my husband said - she IS our family! She has done so much for us it’s time to give a little Back.
Thank you again to this community for your support and advice.
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PaulaM
Moderator.
Member since 2007: surgery, conservative . Montana, USA
Posts: 19,941
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Post by PaulaM on Nov 20, 2024 19:30:38 GMT -7
Marissa, with report of much neuro function confirmed existing by the surgeon, no doubt Marissa will walk again with time! You will get more out of a hands on top of your hands expressing lesson by watching the video first should you need to do an express check after Rosie has peed all she can until you are confident she can fully empty the bladder.: Does the bassinet Pet stroller have a top enclosure (net or fabric) which can be zipped securely closed? The recovery suite, whether that is a pet stroller or a wire recovery suite will be Rosie's protection from your two little ones as she heals. When you need to take Rosie out for potty or surgeon directed exercise, make sure the little ones are in a safe place. As your attention needs to be 100% on Rosie whenever she is out of her suite. And Rosie doesn't need any distractions of other dogs or young children when she feels vulnerable. From what you report it may not be many weeks before Rosie is feeling confident. Let us know for how many weeks does the surgeon want for post-op rest. Often it is for 4 or 6 weeks. What does the surgeon direct for at home PT for the back legs? If Rosie can walk with aid of a rear sling, it might be a slow and careful walk to the potty place. POTTY TIMES Carry to and from the recovery suite to the potty place and then allow a very few limited footsteps. Using a sling (long winter scarf, ace bandage, belt) will save your back and help to keep a wobbly dog's back aligned and butt from tipping over. A harness and 6 foot leash is to control speed and keep footsteps to minimum as you stand in one spot. An ex-pen in the grass is an excellent alternative to minimizing footsteps with the physical and visual to indicate there will be no sniff festing going on until the surgeon has ok'd walking around After Rosie has peed as much as she can, do an express check to make sure the bladder is really empy of urine. Urine remaining in the bladder can quickly become a breeding ground for bacteria (UTI). Expect to take her out as often as she would before the disc episode. Maybe every 3-4 hours and eventually if she stays dry in her suite every 6 hrs. Let us know what meds she is sent home on. Name of each med with ?mg dose ?x/day (either every 12 or 8 hrs?) Very exciting to hear Rosie will be back in her home tomorrow.
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Post by Marissa & Rosie on Nov 24, 2024 6:04:58 GMT -7
Hello, Rosie is home 11/23.
She is on Pepcid Prednisone 5mg - tapering off. Tomorrow starts once a day for 3 days. Then every other day. Trazadone and gabapentin - 50mg - every 8 hours
[MED LIST/HISTORY- Moderator's Note. Please do not edit 16 lbs 13y.o. 11/16 some feeling in one rear leg, 11/17 post-op very limited ability to use back legs. 11/20 feels deep pain in bot rear legs. prednisone gabapentin 50mgs 3x/day trazadone 50 mgs3x/day pepcid ?mg ?x/day ]
Expressing: she seems to clear her bladder. We’ve tried expressing but nothing comes out. I’m worried we’re doing something wrong.
She is very lethargic this afternoon and evening. Which is a change from how she was this morning - I had to lay on the floor with her because she was trying to climb out of her zone. Is this normal? We’re just a bit worried.
Today was the first day we took her outside to potty. It’s been snowing here and we didn’t want to bring her out.
She’s eating and drinking well.
So it’s really just her energy level. Thank you for any advice!
[11/24] It’s definitely the meds/recovery that’s making her less energetic. She’s back to herself this morning. Currently screaming at me because I got up off the floor for a minute.
We did her exercises this morning and she’s fighting me on both legs now which I think is a positive sign! She is also standing really well on her right hind leg (while I’m doing the exercises on the left!).
I’m still worried I’m not fully clearing her bladder when I express her. She’s peeing a ton on her own - so maybe there’s nothing left? I’m just worried about everything and thinking I’m going to cause her more pain because I’m inexperienced at this.
Thank you,
Marissa
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Post by Ann Brittain on Nov 24, 2024 6:54:45 GMT -7
I'm glad to hear Rosie is doing better today and more like her normal self. Meds can definitely cause a dog to be lethargic which, in a way, is a good thing. It keeps them from becoming too active which can lead to a setback in recovery.
If Rosie is peeing a lot on her own, there is a good chance she emptying
her bladder. Just in case she isn't, I would continue trying to express her. It takes practice to feel comfortable with expressing a dog, but once you get the 'feel' for it, it won't seem so daunting. When she goes to the vet, you could ask them to check her bladder to be sure she is empty. Also watch for any signs of urinary tract infection, stinky or dark urine can be signs of UTI's.
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PaulaM
Moderator.
Member since 2007: surgery, conservative . Montana, USA
Posts: 19,941
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Post by PaulaM on Nov 24, 2024 12:35:00 GMT -7
Marissa, proof of bladder control (that is a dog is really peeing on their own) is that the dog can 1st sniff an old pee spot outdoors and 2nd then choose to release urine there. -- It usually takes about a week of expressing before an owner truly reaches the proficiency level to get all the urine out of the bladder at a session. -- Do you find any leaks in her bedding? While on pred a dog may be more thirsty and a need for a potty break every 3-4 hours. Once off of pred potty breaks can go do every 4-6 hrs. And likely can stay dry at bedtime til potty break in the am. -- When bladder control begins to return, a dog may not be able to get all the urine out at the potty break. This is why you should do a quick express check after Rosie releases urine until you have confidence she is pretty much emptying the bladder at each potty break to avoid a bladder infection. -- The body self repairs nerve damage in a very predictable order. Update us on Rosie's neuro status: 1. √11/20 Deep Pain Sensation: Identified by the Neuro in both back legs 2. ?_Tail wagging with joy at specifically hearing YOUR happy talk, seeing you or getting food. 3. ?_Bladder and bowel control verified with the "sniff and pee" test. 4. ? Weak rear leg movement to reposition herself in the suite. ?_ Attempts to move up into a stand position without any assistance from you, __ Can move up into a stand by herself _ and then wobbly walking. 5. _ Being able to walk with more steadiness and _ properly place the paw without it knuckling under. 6. _ Ability to walk unassisted and perhaps even run. LEARN MORE: dodgerslist.com/nerve-healing-after-disc-episode/For how many weeks post-op rest does the surgeon want which includes his directed at home PT. Which exercises did the surgeon direct for Rosie? Post-op PT for the paralyzed IVDD dog: Pepcid AC: what is the dose in mgs and how many times a day?
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