|
Post by Crystal & Abby on Sept 23, 2013 19:21:17 GMT -7
Abby is my 4 year old girl that I have had less than two years after rescuing her from a shelter where she was taken out of a hording/ puppy mill situation. She's a shy but sweet little girl. She started having signs of back problems last Monday and she spent a week at our local vet until she started having more neurological decline last night. So I drove her the 2+ hours to the university vet hospital where they do the surgical procedures and imaging studies to determine where the lesion is. They did a CT and found a disk herniation at the T12-13 interspace and they took her to surgery. She was not paralyzed but her motor function was declining. The surgery went well today and she woke up well from anesthesia. We hope to bring her home on Thursday.
|
|
Sabrina
Helpful Member
My Charley-dog, a Dodger'sList grad enjoying life!
Posts: 471
|
Post by Sabrina on Sept 23, 2013 21:43:01 GMT -7
|
|
PaulaM
Moderator.
Member since 2007: surgery, conservative . Montana, USA
Posts: 19,549
|
Post by PaulaM on Sept 24, 2013 10:01:23 GMT -7
Hi Crystal, thanks for joining us all on the Forum.
How is Abby doing post op today? Is Abby your red dachsie ? Thanks for giving Abby a forever home!
|
|
|
Post by Crystal & Abby on Sept 24, 2013 10:42:01 GMT -7
Abby is my 4yr old red longhaired girl. They said she was doing ok this AM still not wanting to move her back legs much. She will stand for just a moment but then prefers to sit. This is how she was before surgery, although I saw her walk as well but she was very wobbly. She is not paralyzed and still has deep and sperficial pain withdrawal. They are starting therapy with passive range of motion exersices. She didn't give much resistance this AM but they had just given her morphine for pain. I'm sure she will be more responsive later today. I'm currently 2+ hours away from her and so I'm communicating with her medical team by phone. I really wish I could go visit her but I have to work. I'm off on Thursday and we are still hoping she will come home then. Crystal Hill
|
|
|
Post by Crystal & Abby on Sept 25, 2013 9:52:30 GMT -7
Abby is still not wanting to walk or use her back legs much. She will stand for a few seconds but then just wants to sit. I wonder how much of it is pain and how much of it is her being very scared around all the strangers without me. They say she is still having urinary retention which is a big change from a dog who normally has submissive peeing and pees whenever even I try and pick her up. I asked them if she has peed on them yet and they said no. So I know she's having urinary retention because she normally pees quite easily!! I was hoping to bring her home tomorrow but they really want her to start peeing on her own first. She has been moved from the ICU today to the regular ward. She will be off the heavy duty pain meds and back on oral meds today.
|
|
PaulaM
Moderator.
Member since 2007: surgery, conservative . Montana, USA
Posts: 19,549
|
Post by PaulaM on Sept 25, 2013 10:37:43 GMT -7
The real criteria for going home is she is off IV pain meds and transitioned to at home pain pills. If she is stable and pain controlled with pills, then inquire about receiving a hands on top of your hands type of expressing lesson. See link below. Dogs do do a lot better healing at home in familiar surrounding and with their loved ones. Bladder control can come back in days or it can take longer…. Abby can do nerve healing at home just as well as in an institution. You can care for Abby for a lot less expense and one on on attention vs. a hospital setting. Read and watch to get more out of an expressing lesson: www.dodgerslist.com/literature/Expressing.htmList to get your own list started for discharge day: www.dodgerslist.com/literature/dischargequestions.htmWhen things settle down, we'd love to have your comments in our directory about the hospital and surgical costs to help another member make a decision: dodgerslist.boards.net/board/10/guidelines-posting State: Hospital: Address: Cost: Date of surgery: What was included in cost (MRI?, days stay, ER? PT? meds for home, sling, etc.)
|
|
|
Post by Crystal & Abby on Sept 26, 2013 16:19:14 GMT -7
I just got home with my girl. She has started urinating on her own in the past 24 hours but they did teach me to palpate the bladder and express her if needed. She can stand on her hind limbs but when she moves she drags them. So she has gotten worse neurologically since surgery, which of course is not uncommon. But she has made pretty decent improvement in just 24 hours. She was so happy to see me today with her tail wagging and she was crying and snuggling up to me. It was so good to see her happy. She also seemed happy once we got home, I took her out to the yard to urinate and she just looked so happy to be there. She was also happy to see Toby and Charlie, my other two dogs. Of course she can only see them from the inside of her recovery area which is a small play pen, then same one I used 4 years ago when Toby had neck surgery. I will continue the exercises and encourage her to stand for short periods to gain strength back in the back legs and hopefully motor will begin to rerun soon.
|
|
|
Post by Crystal & Abby on Sept 26, 2013 21:17:33 GMT -7
I have a question. Since Abby can stand (if I position her back legs) how long do you think it will be before I start seeing some motor returning? She can wag her tail. I saw that today She will be post op day four tomorrow. I know it can vary quite a lot, I just can't remember how long it took Toby. And his neuro status was way worse prior to his surgery than Abby's was. He had lost all but deep pain response prior to his surgery. But then again, his was a cervical disk rupture so I suppose I shouldn't be comparing episodes. Or dogs I suppose. I'm so glad I have her home! Now I just want her to get better and I have to tell myself to be patient and give her time to heal. She's exhausted but happy to be home with her family. I'm sure she hasn't had a real good night sleep since all this started a week ago Monday when I first noticed her hurting. She has pretty much been away from home this whole time. She seems comfortable. She was snoring earlier
|
|
Marjorie
Moderator~
Member since 2011. Surgery & Conservative
Posts: 5,724
|
Post by Marjorie on Sept 27, 2013 6:22:09 GMT -7
Hi, Crystal I'm sure Abby will do much better at home and is very relieved to be there. She's through the worst of it and now can settle down to heal. The surgery itself can cause some swelling around the spinal cord which can take a couple of weeks to subside. Until this swelling goes down, those nerves to her legs still have pressure on them and are not properly receiving signals. Unfortunately, no one can tell you when or if neurological function will return. Each dog is different and there's no set time table. The fact that her tail is wagging and she's urinating on her own are all very good signs of improvement. You might want to look into acupuncture or laser light therapy if that's in your budget - more info here: www.dodgerslist.com/literature/healingacupuncture.htm And after Abby's stitches come out, water therapy can be very helpful, too. Some of those exercises can be done right in the bathtub: www.dodgerslist.com/literature/watertherapy.htmThoughts and prayers for continuing improvement for Abby.
|
|
|
Post by Crystal & Abby on Sept 27, 2013 15:24:00 GMT -7
Thanks for the info! I found out today that one of the newer vets at the vet clinic I go to is a certified acupuncturist and has done some rehab work on dogs with spinal surgery and that they can also incorporate laser light therapy! I had no idea! We have an evaluation scheduled with Dr Smith on Monday. I'm glad I called my regular vet today to check into it. Abby seemed to sleep pretty well in her regular kennel last night. I'm starting to see some small movements in her right leg. Nothing on the left yet. She was standing pretty well for me today. She is still urinating well and defecated outside in the yard. Her pain seems well controlled. She is eating and drinking well.
|
|
|
Post by Pauliana on Sept 27, 2013 19:32:37 GMT -7
|
|
|
Post by RustysMom on Sept 27, 2013 21:12:26 GMT -7
Hi Crystal... my boy Rusty just had surgery on 9/14. He just had his 3rd laser treatment today, and I think they are really helping. He had them about a year ago when he had his first disc disease episode, and although I wasn't too sure at first, I was sold on them once I took him for the series of 6 sessions. In just this past week since starting the laser treatments, I have really noticed an improvement in his motor coordination and strength. Only problem is, he is feeling so much better, he really wants to get out of his crate and walk around. It's good to hear that Abby is improving also...best wishes for you and Abby in the coming weeks :-)
|
|
|
Post by Crystal & Abby on Sept 28, 2013 21:15:19 GMT -7
Hello, I'm glad to hear Rusty is doing so well! That's really great to hear. It sounds like you have seen good results. I'm anxious to hear what the vet will say on Monday after she evaluates Abby for laser light and acupuncture therapy. Abby seems to be more bright eyed today and has some movements in both of her back legs now. They are not near as flaccid when she moves around, it's almost more of a scooting motion with them, so I'm hoping that's a good thing. She was moving that tail a bunch today and she has been more active in her pen. Eating, drinking, urinating, defecating and pain control are all going well. One thing that bothers me is that I have made her yelp a couple of times picking her up , I'm trying to be so careful and I feel so bad when I hurt her. Luckily, the vast majority of the time it's fine. It's only been a problem a couple of times. I'm just trying to figure out exactly what I'm doing when it hurts her. Maybe I'm putting to much pressure to close to the laminectomy site or something. I just don't want to cause anymore problems for sure!
|
|
Marjorie
Moderator~
Member since 2011. Surgery & Conservative
Posts: 5,724
|
Post by Marjorie on Sept 29, 2013 5:45:14 GMT -7
Hi, Crystal
If Abby is yelping when you pick her up, and you're picking her up correctly, then her pain isn't completely under control. What are the exact dosages in mgs and frequency of dosage of each of her meds?
I'm going to pass along a video of how to properly pick up Abby so you can see if you're doing that the correct way. This is the way she will always need to be lifted from now on.
|
|
|
Post by Crystal & Abby on Sept 29, 2013 7:50:50 GMT -7
Thanks for the video. I'm trying to do that but it gets complicated when she rolls onto her side or back and cowers. See Abby was a rescued girl and she is a very shy submissive little girl and she really doesn't like being picked up, even when she was well. She also has submissive peeing, and pees pretty much every time we pick her up, even before this all happened. The way we worked around the submissive peeing issue was that we just didn't pick her up (or hover over her or anything scary to her like that) unless she was already on our lap otherwise she would pee. Now that's not really an option, obviously, since we have to take care of her in this way. Don't get the wrong idea, she has made dramatic improvement in her shyness and submissiveness since we got her about 1 year 10 months ago but now that she has had this injury and surgery it has been a bit complicated again. She trusts me and loves her family but she is just a shy submissive girl. The couple times she yelped was when I was trying to get her into a proper position to pick her up and I'm wondering if I just put to much pressure on the surgery site or something. She was fine this morning. No yelping. She is on carprofen .5 of 25mg every 12 hours codeine .5 of I believe a 7.5 mg tab every 8 hours.
|
|
StevieLuv
Helpful Member
Conservative Treatment 3x. It really does work!
Posts: 1,335
|
Post by StevieLuv on Sept 29, 2013 11:22:08 GMT -7
Stevie does that too - not submissively but more of a "rather than pick me up, how about you rub my belly!" She will turn right over on her back and it is hard to get her rolled over to pick her up properly, she acts like a sack of grain. I was terrified to try and pick her up for a long time - but it has gotten better with practice. You will develop a technique all your own too
|
|
|
Post by RustysMom on Sept 29, 2013 20:44:37 GMT -7
Rusty will do the same thing too! When I reach down to pick him up, he will flip over with his belly up, hoping ( or more like demanding!) a belly rub...and then when he knows I am wanting to pick him up, he just goes into his "limp dog" routine, still holding out for the belly rub!
|
|
|
Post by Pauliana on Sept 29, 2013 22:06:37 GMT -7
My Tyler does the exact same thing. It happens all the time, when we want to pick him up or when we want to put his harness and leash on him.. Glad to know he's in great company with Abby, Rusty and Stevie wanting belly rubs instead of whatever we had planned. LOL
|
|
PaulaM
Moderator.
Member since 2007: surgery, conservative . Montana, USA
Posts: 19,549
|
Post by PaulaM on Sept 30, 2013 8:06:40 GMT -7
Crystal, we have seen the damage NSAIDs can do to the GI tract, so we follow the vets who are proactive to protect the stomach. The FDA and manufacturer pkg insert indicate gastrointestinal problems are side effects of using NSAIDs. The natural defenses of the stomach to shield against stomach acid is hindered when taking NSAIDs. Serious gastrointestinal toxicity such as bleeding, ulceration, and perforation, can occur at any time, with or without warning symptoms. Phrase the question to your vet this particular way:" Is there a medical/health reason my dog may not take Pepcid?" If there is no reason, then 5mg Pepcid (famotidine) 30 minutes before the NSAID and thereafter every 12 hours. This is the directory I use to get up to speed on each of my dog's meds: www.marvistavet.com/html/pharmacy_center.htmGlad to hear no pain this morning!!
|
|
|
Post by Crystal & Abby on Sept 30, 2013 17:02:21 GMT -7
Ok. I can do that on the Pepcid. Thanks.
Abby had her first acupuncture treatment today. The vet said it went well. They did another laser light treatment on her too, I guess they had been doing that on her prior to her surgery as well. They said it really helped her relax today, so hopefully it will help enhance the healing process. She has another round set up for Wednesday.
When she uses her back legs now, most of the movement is in her thighs. Although if she manages to keep the legs under her instead of them flopping behind her, I've seen her do some scooting motions with her legs. I've done some sling walking with her (using a leash or a stocking under her belly), but so far she hasn't taken to it very well. Tonight when we got home from the vet, I fed her and then took her outside. She defecated and was able to get into a much more normal looking posture with her legs more under her. I'm seeing small improvements everyday.
|
|
|
Post by RustysMom on Oct 1, 2013 10:17:14 GMT -7
Crystal- I don't know if you have one of these, they sent us home with one after Rusty's surgery...and it works WONDERFULLY for walking! They are pretty easy to make if you get the supplies. You can get leashes at many dollar tree stores, and the stretchy bandage/tape stuff probably at most drug stores, etc. At first Rus wasn't too jazzed about it, but now after 2 weeks, he and I both have it down to a great system, and it's is so easy for us both... www.dodgerslist.com/literature/cratesupplies/Figure8.jpg
|
|
|
Post by Crystal & Abby on Oct 1, 2013 17:31:35 GMT -7
Hey thanks. I might have to make one of those and see if she likes it. Today Abby seems to be moving her legs even more. She is keeping them under her in a more normal position much more now. She can use them to scoot or push herself along. She was able to kind of get into somewhat of a standing position by herself this morning, although her back legs weren't fully extended. I also saw her do this bunny rabbit hop type movement today. So it seems that some more motor is returning. There are times they still flop behind her but I always reposition them as soon as see them doing that as the vet said to do. She has another acupuncture treatment tomorrow afternoon. How long should she be on the anti inflammatory? I'm almost out of pain meds too. I started the Pepcid.
|
|
PaulaM
Moderator.
Member since 2007: surgery, conservative . Montana, USA
Posts: 19,549
|
Post by PaulaM on Oct 1, 2013 19:35:01 GMT -7
EAch dog is different on how long post op pain lasts. Usually post op swelling lasts about 2 weeks, but then some dog do not come home on any meds. So check with your vet to see when to stop to see if she is out of pain. And be prepared to have something on hand over the weekend if needed. Let us know what the vet says.
Sounds like nerves functions are really going in the right direction!!!
|
|
|
Post by Crystal & Abby on Oct 2, 2013 7:14:28 GMT -7
I saw Abby take a few wobbly cross legged steps with her back legs this morning!! Post op day 9. This afternoon she will go to the vet for her second acupuncture and e-stim treatment and a laser light treatment. Crystal
|
|
|
Post by Crystal & Abby on Oct 2, 2013 21:27:39 GMT -7
Abby seemed to do pretty well today with her treatments and was fairly tired tonight as they said she would be. The vet refilled her anti inflammatory for another 10 days and agreed to the 5 mg Pepcid (although I had already started it without issue). She also said to transition her to Tramadol from codeine for pain, which is what we were using prior to surgery, since I gave her her last codeine pill tonight. This weekend I have to go out of town and so my three dogs will be in three different places. Usually I just have a house/dog sitter while I'm gone, but because of Abby's needs she will stay at the vet so she can get her meds and laser treatments and Toby, my 10 year old doxie, will stay with my mom. Charlie, the newest member, a 6 mo old doxie mix, is staying with my usual dog sitter. I'm a bit worried that I'll miss something going on with Abby while I'm gone. Hopefully, she will just continue her day to day improvements even while I'm gone. Her next acupuncture will be next Wednesday.
|
|
|
Post by Crystal & Abby on Oct 3, 2013 17:33:58 GMT -7
Seems like Abby has been less inclined to try and walk today and I'm not sure why. I'm a bit worried because I was seeing some progress everyday and today she just doesn't want to seem to do much except roll over on her side and back when I try and work with her. She doesn't seem to be in pain. Maybe she just needs a rest day?
|
|
Marjorie
Moderator~
Member since 2011. Surgery & Conservative
Posts: 5,724
|
Post by Marjorie on Oct 3, 2013 18:10:19 GMT -7
How much therapy are you doing with Abby, Crystal? Is she still on meds? If so, the pain meds would be masking any pain she may still have from the surgery so she still may have swelling around the spine. It can take a couple of weeks for that swelling to go down. She's still in the crate other than for potty and PT, correct? I'm glad she'll be at the vet's this weekend so he can keep an eye on her. She may just be tired. I remember Jeremy getting very tired of his therapy and not wanting to do it. Please let us know how she is tomorrow.
|
|
|
Post by Crystal & Abby on Oct 3, 2013 19:49:27 GMT -7
Every time I take her out of her confinement I work with her a bit, so in the morning, around noon, in the evening when I get home from work and maybe little before bed. She pretty much spends her time in confinement the rest of the time. Although at nite I have held her for a bit so I can rub her belly and give her some tactile stimulation around her back legs and feet. The vet suggested this. Then she sleeps in her crate. I made one of those figure 8 slings and tried it but it didn't seem to work any better than a stocking or a leash or a small towel at least not yet. She's just not to keen on the idea of me helping pick up her back end while she's trying to ambulate. All she does when we try it is roll over on her side or back. When I saw her do her wobbly walk was on her own on the patio with no help from me. She did maybe a couple of steps line that this evening but she seemed pretty tired today. She is on Tramadol, carprofen and Pepcid. She did have acupuncture and e-stim and laser light therapy yesterday afternoon so maybe all that plus changing back to Tramadol from codeine has worn her out. She doesn't act like she is in pain. No shaking or yelping or tension in her belly or anything like that. In fact, she's pretty much back to acting like her normal self now if only those darn back legs would just cooperate! I'm sure she's thinking the same thing!
|
|
|
Post by Crystal & Abby on Oct 4, 2013 9:10:58 GMT -7
So today Abby seems to be trying harder, I saw her take a few more wobbly steps this morning so I'm much less worried now. I think she was just worn out yesterday.
|
|
Marjorie
Moderator~
Member since 2011. Surgery & Conservative
Posts: 5,724
|
Post by Marjorie on Oct 4, 2013 14:19:46 GMT -7
Good! I'm glad to hear she was more willing today to try some steps. Just take it slow and easy with her. I hope she does well this weekend while you're away. All the best to you and Abby.
|
|