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Post by Samantha & Zuzu on Feb 25, 2023 14:43:19 GMT -7
Hello,
It’s Zuzu and Samantha here. Unfortunately, after 3 years, we think Zuzu may be having another disc episode. We aren’t 100% certain but want to be cautious as she declined quickly last time.
Tuesday morning (Feb. 21), when I went to lift her from our bed, where she sleeps with us, I noticed she was trembling and not her usual perky self. I brought her downstairs, put her down, and noticed her walk was hesitant and her back legs seemed slightly weak (not positioned straight how they typically would be and maybe ever so slightly wobbly). I notified my husband and we grabbed the harness we used during the previous episode to assist with the bathroom. When putting it on her, she yelped and started trembling and squirming, indicating it was causing her discomfort. We quickly took it off and opted to take her out for a bathroom break without it. In hindsight, the harness probably wasn’t necessary at this stage. After a quick bathroom break, Zuzu was crated immediately (Feb. 21). We have continued to carry her to and from the backyard for bathroom breaks due to the stairs.
We contacted our vet, who is very familiar with Zuzu’s history. The vet (DVM) saw her [2/22] the next morning, and after physically examining her, she believes Zuzu is having an IVDD flare up. She is now taking gabapentin (100 mg capsule, 2x a day for 14 days) and meloxicam (0.35 ml 1x a day).
[MED LIST/HISTORY- Moderator's Note. Please do not edit ]
12 lbs 9 y.0.
meloxicam as of 2/22: ?mgs (0l35mL 1x/day for 14 days, 3/8 test STOP for: _pain?/_neuro?
gabapentin 100mgs 2x/xday STOP on 3/8
Zuzu needs GI tract protector, Pepcid AC, on board for duration of Meloxicam]
Over the last three days, there has been no trembling or yelping and she is her usual self (albeit not thrilled to be strictly crated). She doesn’t appear to have any swelling at this point and is moving very well during quick bathroom breaks. She has a spring to her step as in she seems more confident and perky (unlike on Feb. 21).
Zuzu is 8 years, 11 months (so basically 9) and weighs 12 lbs. Over the last three years, since her previous episode, she received regular acupuncture.
Any thoughts and advice greatly appreciated.
Love, Samantha and Zuzu
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Post by Romy & Frankie on Feb 25, 2023 15:31:24 GMT -7
Welcome back to Dodgerslist. I am sorry that Zuzu is having another disc episode. You did the very best thing by immediately stating strict crate rest. As you likely remember the crate rest is to limit movements which will allow the disc to heal. It takes 8 weeks of essentially 24/7 strict crate rest for good strong scar tissue to form.
STRICT means: - no laps
- no couches - no baths
- no sleeping with you - no chiro therapy
- no dragging or meandering at potty times Carry Zuzu to and from the recovery suite to the potty place and then allow a very few limited footsteps.
You can refresh your memory of crate rest here: www.dodgerslist.com/2020/05/14/strict-rest-recovery-proc
Zuzu should be taking a stomach protector like Pepcid AC while she is taking meloxicam. All anti-inflammatories cause excess stomach acid, which can cause serious stomach damage Ask the vet if Zuzu has any health issues to prevent use of Pepcid AC (famotidine)? (doesn’t need it, we wait til there is problem…are NOT answers to your question!) If you get a “no health” issues answer, then go to the grocery store to purchase over the counter Pepcid AC containing one single active ingredient (famotidine)
The usual dose of Pepcid AC (famotidine) for dogs is 0.44mg per pound, 30 mins before the anti-inflammatory and thereafter every 12 hours for as long as your dog is on the anti-inflammatory. For ZuZu the dose would be 5mgs.
We have information on what to expect for each phase of healing at the link below:
A medication chart is useful to see patterns, and allows you to have dates and specific facts handy as you discuss things with the vet. You can download a sample and a blank form to use with your dog's meds:
For how many days has the Meloxicam been prescribed? Do you know how many mgs of meloxicam are in one mL of the liquid?
Some info on meds for IVDD is here:
It won't take long for you to get back up to speed on IVDD. More information can be found at our main website: www.dodgerslist.com |
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Post by Samantha & Zuzu on Mar 7, 2023 16:51:25 GMT -7
Thank you for the helpful information and refresher.
Zuzu continues to do well. She is walking well (looks normal, to us) when taking her bathroom breaks. We have been giving her half a tablet of trazodone once daily to calm her in her crate (25mg once a day, if needed). She is more restless in the evenings, so we typically give it to her then.
Today marks two weeks of strict crate rest.
Do you think we could stop the meloxicam or at least do a test stop? Can we also do the same for gabapentin (stop completely or do a test stop)? How long should the test stop last? Our vet said to give both the anti-inflammatory and pain meds to her for two weeks, but we’re wondering if they should be extended. I have requested refills just incase so I have them on hand.
Thank you, kindly.
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PaulaM
Moderator. 
Member since 2007: surgery, conservative . Montana, USA
Posts: 19,928
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Post by PaulaM on Mar 7, 2023 18:51:08 GMT -7
Samantha, the short answer is YES stop both the meloxicam and the gabapentin on 3/8. We count on the dates you provide to accurately follow along and make comments. It seems then the Meloxicam was not started on 2/22 at the vet visit? What date did Meloxicam start on?I see you are curious trying to imagine how meds work with a disc episode. It is excellent to be curious and ask questions. Knowledge puts you in a good position to better understand what the vet says/Rx's. And it allows you to bring up good questions to him when necessary. Here are your answers. 1) This page is all about use of anti-inflammatory drugs during a disc episode. Good reading since Zuzu was born with this disease: dodgerslist.com/2020/04/18/steroids-vs-nsaids/ 2) All vets must take a guess how long to use an anti-inflammatory such as Meloxicam. All that is known it is may take in the range of 7 to 30 days before Meloxicam can resolve all painful swelling. 3) No one wants continue using Meloxicam when the benefit has already been achieved. So most vets guess with a 5-7day course or a 14-day course. 4) Pain meds will blindfold you at home from correctly and quicklyu observing if pain would surface. Therefore on the date Meloxicam is stopped the pain med gabapentin is also stopped. 5) RULE OF THUMB with Meloxicam stop pain = swelling = another Meloxicam course, pain meds and Pepcid AC
no pain = all swelling is gone. No need of any meds. Finish weeks of crate rest to allow the disc to heal Graduation day from STRICT rest is on 4/18. Keep up the good work of very limited footsteps (no walking around) at potty time. Strict rest is how the disc will be able to heal and prevent impacting the spinal cord/neuro diminishment. Please keep us posted as the meds are stopped that you continue to see no pain surfacing when having to move. And that you see no backward steps, no neuro diminishment of wobbly walking. Those things would mean the vet needs to know asap and likely another course of Meloxicam, pain med(s) AND the acid suppressor Pepcid AC. Did you ever get Pepcid AC (famotidine) on board? |
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Post by Samantha & Zuzu on Mar 13, 2023 11:02:44 GMT -7
Thank you for the helpful information. It’s appreciated.
Zuzu started both Meloxicam and Gabapentin on the 22nd of February and finished on the 7th of March (2 weeks). I checked with my husband as he’s been the one administering the meds.
Since stopping both, Zuzu has not shown signs of pain and seems very comfortable. She is walking very well from what we can tell (though we haven’t had a really good look at this since we limit her steps during potty breaks).
Sometimes she rolls around in her crate (like she has an itch). It doesn’t happen often and she does it briefly as there isn’t much room. She’ll roll on her back and wiggle a bit back and forth. When not in crate rest, she’d typically do this on one of our spacious rugs. Should we try to stop this behaviour while she’s on crate rest?
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Marjorie
Moderator~ 
Member since 2011. Surgery & Conservative
Posts: 5,724 
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Post by Marjorie on Mar 13, 2023 15:23:04 GMT -7
Rolling on her back shows that Zuzu is indeed pain free. With the meds having stopped on 3/7, no sign of pain means that the swelling pressing on the nerves of her spine has gone down and meds are no longer needed. Now all that is needed is to continue the full 8 weeks of strict crate rest. Do what you can to command her to stop rolling on her back or perhaps redirect her attention to doing something else such as giving a small treat. Other than that there is not much you can do about the rolling.
Zuzu is doing very well and we're so glad to hear it. Please continue to keep us updated.
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Post by Samantha & Zuzu on Apr 20, 2023 13:57:27 GMT -7
Hello there, Zuzu is out of crate rest and doing well! Aside from really needing her nails trimmed, she is moving very well. We have her next acupuncture appointment booked with her regular rehab/therapy vet and looking forward to getting her feedback. Unfortunately, she needs to be sedated to get her nails trimmed and we will need to book that soon. Any suggestions for how long we should wait post crate rest to get nails trimmed with sedative? She gets her nails trimmed with sedative at her regular vet and they’re familiar with her IVDD history, but we will emphasize proper handling to protect her back and remind them Zuzu had a very recent disc episode. Thank you for all of your help. I revisited often to get strength as this was especially difficult this time around. She felt really good rather quickly and is very vocal, at times. And I’m a recent first time mom (to a human) and Zu a first time big sister. She’s happy to be out and interacting with her baby brother!Love, Samantha and Zuzu |
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PaulaM
Moderator.
Member since 2007: surgery, conservative . Montana, USA
Posts: 19,928
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Post by PaulaM on Apr 20, 2023 18:26:21 GMT -7
Samantha, congratulations on two fronts! 🎊 What a delight to have an addition to your family — a baby boy and Zuzu to have completed crate rest! Happy but busy times at home for you I bet. NAIL TRIMs are important for an IVDD dog. Long nails throw the body out of balance. As long as the vet and those involved understand to carefully support both ends when carrying and rotating her body during sedation, it should be ok. You may want to learn more about what nail trims are for a health reason especially for IVDD dogs ==> dodgerslist.com/2020/07/22/nail-trim-for-health/Remember: GRADUATION is a time for SLOW RE-INTRODUCTION Zuzu's muscles are soft and out of shape after the rest period. Gradually build up her muscles and lungs. Plan on a month's time of gradually increasing walk lengths will have her dog safely running and having fun again! SAMPLE SCHEDULE Here is a sample schedule to safely and slowly introduce your dog back to family life and physical activity: dodgerslist.com/2020/06/15/back-friendly/?highlight=sample%20scheduleTRAINING
Does she need a refresher on using ramps and not taking a shortcut at the bottom or not jumping up or down from things?
Lots more ideas and tips in living with an IVDD dog such as dentals that also involve sedation ==> dodgerslist.com/living-with-ivdd-tips-2 |
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