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Post by Amy & Andy on Aug 22, 2022 19:21:01 GMT -7
☆ 1 His pain is well managed & he doesn't show any of these signs of pain2 19-20 lbs Age? 9Aug 3 started Gabapentin 100mg 1 capsule twice per day as needed, Metacam 1.5mg/ml Give 0.6ml by mouth every 24 hrs for 2 weeks then once daily as needed. [MED LIST/HISTORY- Moderator's Note. Please do not edit
19-20 lbs 9 y.o.
Metacam as of 8/3: 9,6mL 1x/day for 14 days, 8/17 test STOP for _pain; _neuro
gabapentin 100mgs 2x/day
Pepcid AC (famotidine) 5mgs 2x/day] No steroid given PEPCID AC: No health issues other than heart murmur - started on Pepcid AC tonite gave 5mg☆ 3 --No signs of stomach damage ☆ 4 Longhaired Dachshund , Andy. Amy Tew ☆ 5 diagnosis IVDD (aka: a disc problem, a disc herniation, a bulging disc, slipped disc)? Yes but without imagingSaw general vet DVM and saw specialist surgeon☆ 6 datefor CONSERVATIVE treatment? Aug 3 initial visit to vet - Aug 8 saw specialist surgeon who was agreeable to try conservative treatment ☆ 7 sniff and squat and then release urine ? Yes - couldn't for 2-3 days but then regained control☆ 8 wobbly walk? Yes move the legs at all? Yes or wag the tail when you specifically do some happy talk? Yes 
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PaulaM
Moderator. 
Member since 2007: surgery, conservative . Montana, USA
Posts: 19,928
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Post by PaulaM on Aug 22, 2022 21:11:19 GMT -7
Amy, welcome to the Forum! There are some confusing things, you can help us better understand. 1) Double check with the vet if you have not already done so about Pepcid AC and heart murmur to make sure it is ok for Andy's heart case if he would be on Metacam. If he is no longer taking Metacam, there is no need for Pepcid AC. --The dose of famotidine may require reduction in patients with liver or kidney disease. -- It may be prudent with heart patients to choose another class of acid reducer.
2) Has gabapentin been also stopped along with the stop of Metacam on 8/17? The stop of the Metacam is to have an understanding if all painful swelling is gone. Gabapentin is a pain meds for nerve pain and if on board or not backed down by less mgs/frequency, hard to know if all swelling is gone. Or if pain not gone, then another course of Metacam would be needed. MEDs with a disc episode They are not giving "as needed" on a daily basis. They are Rx'd for mgs/frequency for the duration of the 14-day course. Can you clear up the confusion for us about using Metacam as needed as well as the pain med 2x/day as needed. 3) What are you actually giving as of today for Metacam (which was indicated it would stop on 8/17 after 14 days of dosing)?4) What are you giving actually as of today for gabapentin. ---------- RULE OF THUMB at end of 14-day Metacam coursePain= another course of Metacam + all pain meds back on board + Pepcid AC No Pain= no need of any meds...just finish out the 8 weeks of crate rest for the disc to heal.The full details on how Metacam, an anti-inflammatory works with a disc episode. Good reading to be able to ask the right questions and discuss Andy's treatment: Amy, is there anything in particular you would like to know more about Andy's care? Sounds very much as though if you committee to STRICT rest for the eight weeks, Andy will have a good graduation on 9/28! Lots of member tips and ideas that make the STRICT rest period and safe potty time go smoother on this page: dodgerslist.com/2020/05/14/strict-rest-recovery-process/
Handy, too, is to have a "Roadmap to Conservative" treatment. It prevents taking dangerous detours by following the true principals of Conservative treatment right up to graduation day.
VIEW, DOWNLOAD and print for your fridge: dodgerslist.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/07/Roadmap-for-Fridge.pdf |
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Post by Amy & Andy on Aug 23, 2022 6:47:30 GMT -7
Thank you for your response! I am so grateful for the work that you do.
1) I will check with the vet today about Pepcid AC (if needed) with his heart murmur
2) My vet just refilled the meds (gabapentin & Metacam) - didn't mention stopping either of them. Unfortunately my vet doesn't seem familiar with IVDD and conservative treatment.
3) I will start today with no meds [Metacam] & watch for pain.
4) gabapentin: I will start today with no meds & watch for pain.
Note: We are doing laser treatments as well as high quality CBD oil
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PaulaM
Moderator.
Member since 2007: surgery, conservative . Montana, USA
Posts: 19,928
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Post by PaulaM on Aug 23, 2022 7:57:33 GMT -7
Moderator Paula is reading your post and preparing a reply. Thank you for your patience 👀 Please refresh your browser to see new replies. ➡️ EMAIL ALERTS Thank you for registering. No you can receive email alerts when someone has posted. Timely interaction/communications is needed when helping your dog. Bookmark your dog's thread to receive an email alert when someone has replied. Go to the CONSERVATIVE Board dodgerslist.boards.net/board/6/conservative 1. Look for your dog's thread and checkmark it. 2. Look for the white ACTIONS button towards top. 3. Select “Notification Options" from the pull down menu — check mark “NEW POST” change from never to INSTANT email — press the SAVE button. Click the “x” to close the window 4. Next choose the “Bookmark” See the tiny book symbol now! i.postimg.cc/GhKYTNg7/Bookmarking.jpg ** |
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PaulaM
Moderator.
Member since 2007: surgery, conservative . Montana, USA
Posts: 19,928
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Post by PaulaM on Aug 23, 2022 8:07:00 GMT -7
Amy, did you connect with your vet to discuss stopping both metacam and also a full stop of gabapentin? Your vet should be involved with any change in meds. Some vets depending on their knowledge of the dog, etc, may decide it is best to back down gabapentin by mgs and frequency. Other vets Rx for a dog- a full stop of gabapentin with full stop of anti-inflammatory . Let us know what your vet wants. Know that the date Metacam stops there is then no need of taking Pepcid AC. The number of days on Metacam is important data. Please confirm and keep us updated on the date Metacam is stopped. HOW to REPLY It is best to avoid quote anything from anothers post. We only want to read your words ,not our words. Just make a sentence with 1-2 words of reference. Thanks for understanding. The fastest for you and most effective way to give a reply: -- scroll down to the " Quick reply" typing area. Quick reply allows scrolling up & down to a previous post. Then back down to the "Quick Reply" typing area to continue your own post.
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Post by Amy & Andy on Aug 23, 2022 9:05:51 GMT -7
Hi, my vet is on vacation right now.
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PaulaM
Moderator.
Member since 2007: surgery, conservative . Montana, USA
Posts: 19,928
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Post by PaulaM on Aug 23, 2022 12:00:21 GMT -7
Hopefully you can discuss Andy with another vet at same clinic to get OK on full stopping gabapentin along with the Metacam.
MED LIST/HISTORY-
19-20 lbs 9 y.o.
Metacam as of 8/3: 0.6mL 1x/day for 20 days, 8/23 test STOP for _pain; _neuro
gabapentin 100mgs 2x/day STOP or back off 8/23?
Pepcid AC (famotidine) 5mgs 2x/day STOP at stop of Metacam
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Post by Amy & Andy on Aug 23, 2022 14:54:05 GMT -7
Left a message with the vet's office. I wasn't aware that I needed to stop the Metacam at 14 days, I called the vet's office the day before he ran out & told them his meds were low & they refilled them with no instructions to me about anything. So for his records - he has been on metacam 8/3-8/22. He doesn't seem to be in any pain so I am going to skip the metacam today 8/23. I gave his am gabapentin this morning but will skip his pm gabapentin & hopefully hear back from the vet [8/24] tomorrow.
[MED LIST/HISTORY- Moderator's Note. Please do not edit
19-20 lbs 9 y.o.
Metacam as of 8/3: 0.6mL 1x/day for 20 days, 8/23 test STOP for _pain; _neuro
"Metacam 1.5mg/ml: Give 0.6ml by mouth every 24 hrs for 2 weeks"
gabapentin 100mgs 1x/day 8/23; stop 8/24
Pepcid AC (famotidine) 5mgs 2x/day STOPPED 8/23?]
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Post by Romy & Frankie on Aug 24, 2022 13:06:56 GMT -7
Stopping the metacam and the gabapentin will make it very clear if all the swelling, which causes the pain, is gone. If a dog is still on the full dose of pain meds when the anti-inflammatory is stopped, pain could be masked, and therefore it will take longer to know if all the swelling is gone. If there is still swelling, more time on the anti-inflammatory and pain meds would be needed.
Please let us know what the vet says when you hear from him.
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Post by Amy & Andy on Aug 24, 2022 14:17:40 GMT -7
Talked to the vet & she said I can use my discretion whether to use the Metacam or gabapentin going forward & use as needed. So since he did well yesterday & today with only 1 gabapentin I will try him tomorrow with no meds & see how he feels. Does that sound right?
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Post by Romy & Frankie on Aug 24, 2022 14:25:54 GMT -7
If when both of the meds are stopped, no pain is seen, the swelling in the spinal cord is gone. In this case, no further IVDD meds are needed. All that is needed is the rest of the 8 weeks of crate rest.
Fingers crossed that this stop will show all the swelling is gone.
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Post by Amy & Andy on Aug 24, 2022 15:06:33 GMT -7
I have another question - he has developed a knot (in the muscle?) near the base of his tail in his hindquarter that he doesn't like me messing with. It does seem like where he is putting a lot of weight when he's in a sitting position. Any clue?
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PaulaM
Moderator.
Member since 2007: surgery, conservative . Montana, USA
Posts: 19,928
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Post by PaulaM on Aug 24, 2022 20:05:14 GMT -7
Can you send a jpg to the vet of the tail knot.
Any broken/abraided skin there?
Red or raw looking?
Is the knot on the underside of the tail base or the top of the base?
Let us know what the vet thinks.
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Post by Amy & Andy on Aug 25, 2022 13:03:49 GMT -7
Happy to report that Andy hasn't had Metacam since 8/22 & is now 24 hours with no gabapentin & seems to be fine - no signs of pain. We have an appointment tomorrow 8/26 with vet to look at hindquarter/tail area.
[MED LIST/HISTORY- Moderator's Note. Please do not edit
19-20 lbs 9 y.o.
Metacam as of 8/3: 0.6mL 1x/day for 20 days, 8/23 test STOP for _pain; _neuro]
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Post by Romy & Frankie on Aug 25, 2022 13:26:44 GMT -7
Good news that Andy is showing no signs of pain with the stop of the Metacam and the gabapentin.
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Post by Amy & Andy on Aug 27, 2022 11:43:02 GMT -7
Vet wasn't concerned about mass/lump in hindquarter, said possibly lipoma? and said bump on base of tail is a wart. Ok for us to continue laser therapy.
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Post by Romy & Frankie on Aug 27, 2022 13:23:58 GMT -7
Good news that the vet thinks that the lump is a lipoma. Lipomas are quite common in dogs and don't usually cause any problems. Just keep an eye on it in case it starts to grow or change.
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Post by Amy & Andy on Sept 21, 2022 14:26:31 GMT -7
Andy is doing so well! We have one more week of crate rest! He's walking well at potty time although a little wobbly. Sometimes he's able to lift one leg slightly when he pees. We don't have access to any kind of physical therapy in my area other than laser - any suggestions when we start transitioning him? I have furniture blocked off & yoga mats on the slippery floor. Absolutely no jumping. But I can tell if I let him off the leash in the yard he would run to the fence & run up & down it with the neighbor's dog. How long do you suggest I keep him on a leash in our yard? Any physical therapy suggestions I can do with him? Thanks for everything!
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Post by Romy & Frankie on Sept 21, 2022 14:48:24 GMT -7
Happy to hear that Andy is doing so well.
IVDD dogs should never jump up or down. This puts too much pressure on the spine. By putting up the furniture blockers, you are assuring that cannot happen.
Dog's coming off crate rest should be gradually re-introduced to activity. Andy will need time to rebuild muscle and stamina. But after he has been eased back into normal activity, he can run. Dogs love to run. What is to be avoided is zigzag running or anything too rambunctious. If seeing the neighbor's dog on the other side of the fence gets him very excited, then having him run with that dog is to be avoided. If not, just running should be fine.
Once Andy graduates, we will have lots of tips on IVDD friendly activities to share with you.
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Post by Amy & Andy on Sept 28, 2022 15:57:22 GMT -7
Hi, Andy graduates today so would love the tips on IVDD friendly activities, etc 
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PaulaM
Moderator.
Member since 2007: surgery, conservative . Montana, USA
Posts: 19,928
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Post by PaulaM on Sept 28, 2022 17:19:37 GMT -7
Amy, moderator Paula is reading and replying to your happy news of graduation today!!!
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PaulaM
Moderator.
Member since 2007: surgery, conservative . Montana, USA
Posts: 19,928
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Post by PaulaM on Sept 28, 2022 17:49:14 GMT -7
Amy, congratulations on Andy's graduation. You did it, you gave him the needed time to heal his disc. Andy will very likely continue on to further heal his weaker leg with time and approach a more normal gait. Now begins a slow and gradual introduction back to physical activity and family life for your couch potato this past 8 weeks.The idea is to gradually give more freedom under controlled conditions. Not free riegn of the house and yard immediately! LOL SAMPLE SCHEDULE You will not want to be confused to decide if overtaxed muscle soreness pain or more serious disc episode. Here is a sample schedule to safely and slowly introduce activity: dodgerslist.com/2020/06/15/back-friendly/?highlight=sample%20schedule DIY back PROTECTION around the house While Andy is still on gradual and supervised activities as he bulks up his muscles, consider how to make your home back friendly. i2.wp.com/dodgerslist.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/07/home-back-protect-banner_700-45kb.jpg ** HAPPY DAYS AHEAD 1) Make it fun....work on training and conditioning his core muscle. Core muscles support the back/disc area. Core exercises don't require specialized equipment. Safety first. You should always consult with a veterinarian before starting any exercise program with your dog. For example, although senior dogs need to stay limber, severe arthritis might make certain movements inappropriate. Here are 5 exercises you can do at home: totofit.com/five-basic-exercises-essential-to-building-core-strength/ FYI: Dogs are best at visual learning rather than verbal commands. Dog trainer Anna Jane Grossman says “Dogs learn in pictures. Inside your dog’s brain is a very simple algorithm – pleasant images in one place and unpleasant images in another." 3) Lots more ideas and tips in living with an IVDD dog (dentals, nail trims, etc.: dodgerslist.com/living-with-ivdd-tips-2 4) Ideas for strengthening back legs at home --- Buy cheap cut of meat or chicken when on sale as really high value treats. Cook, cut into tiny treats and freeze to use as needed each day. --- Do all PT where there are no other distractions of kids or other dogs. --- Do PT slowly so that steps are deliberate- helps to re-train the nerves and muscles to work together in a more normal gait pattern. --- Surface with good traction such as carpet or use of a Yoga mat or rug runners --- Do therapy at meal times. Feed dinner a few kibbles at a time, for stands, sits. Scatter some kibbles on a non-slippery floor and use sling if wobbly walking to get his food. --- reward for pushing up from a sit to a stand. ---Use sticks, broom, pvc pipes spaced out on good traction carpet. Dog then will learn to lift paws as they walk SLOWLY over each one. --- Single leg balance for the weaker leg. While standing, lift the stronger leg off the ground for a few seconds-this will force bearing weight on the weaker leg. Lower and repeat with the opposite side leg. --- Outdoors on leash/harness and if needed a sling if too wobbly. Walk across a gentle slope, walk up and down the slope. Walk on different textures...low grass, higher grass, on sand. ---At home water therapy if you live in a warm climate at this date or have a good sized indoor tub. Lower levels of water give greater challenge to moving leg exercising: dodgerslist.com/2020/05/28/surgery-dog-water-therapy/May we turn the tables and ask YOU for help? Did you know there are less than a handful who volunteer daily to help dogs and their owners? We really need helping hands from other Forum members in educating. Education about disc disease is our number one mission! We invite you to hop on to our educational bandwagon team. Too many dogs are put to sleep because owners lack education about IVDD treatment. STRICT crate rest and proper medication have helped many dogs recover. We depend on all members to pay it forward for the help they have received with their dog by helping us educate! Pick what suits you....
We depend on you. Here are some ways to help.. i.postimg.cc/R0y7zpGx/IVDD-survior-gallery.jpg ** -- Please celebrate Andy's graduation! Add a graduation photo and a short caption to our Gallery to give other members inspiration about your IVDD Survivor! dodgerslist.boards.net/thread/2262/add-dog-dodgerslist-photo-gallery-- "Share" our FB posts www.facebook.com/Dodgerslist-- When in conversation at the grocery store line or wherever you may meet breeds most prone to IVDD (Dachshunds, Beagles, Poodles, Spaniels, Shih Tzus, Pekingese, and Chihuahuas, Frenchies) give out our free little wallet cards. Hand carry our literature and print out our letter of introduction for your vet. linkable [► ORDER BROCHURES & cards, they're free!◀︎] for your vet and wallet cards for you: i.postimg.cc/HxfzpNkT/help-order-350-32kb.jpgDon't be a stranger! Stop in periodically. We really do love to hear how your dog is doing. We'd love a short video clip to see Andy in action at home, at PT and living & loving life in spite of IVDD! if you see a new member in a tough spot, give them hope. A brief paragraph about your dog can be insanely supportive and inspiring in a time of need! i.postimg.cc/8P5FkBYy/living-laugh-love-in-spite.png |
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