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Post by Jessica Lott on May 31, 2020 3:14:50 GMT -7
Hi everyone, thank you so much for accepting me into your forum. We’ve had an extremely traumatic few days and any support, guidance and positivity would be so appreciated. So here goes:
Dogs name: Anya Breed: Black Russian terrier Age: 7 years 9 months Weight: 50kg [128 lbs.] Past medical history: arthritis front right leg Location: Birmingham, UK
Anya has been her happy, lazy self all week. She’s very much a person dog and very good motivated. On Thursday I noticed she was struggling to get up from a sitting position and shuffling her front paws. I assumed it must be her arthritis so gave her metacam and ordered a new bottle from the vets to collect the following day.
Friday morning she was still limping on the front left paw. I decided to give Anya a lockdown haircut as the weather is continuing to be hot here. Following her hair cut she appeared to still be limping and my husband thought her back legs now looked stiff. I then went to collect her metacam and when I got back my husband told me Anya had collapsed trying to get off our low sofa. We then took Anya straight to the vets. At this point she had begun to knuckle on her hind left leg and was becoming unable to weight bear.
The vet kept Anya in and did a neurological assessment. She said Anya needed to be transferred to willows veterinary centre for an assessment by a neurologist. This was booked for Monday and the plan was for Anya to come home with us over the weekend. Anya came home but over night didn’t urinate. I became anxious about this and called willows who said to bring her in.
Prior to me talking her in Anya could not walk and could only hold her own weight if supported. She could still give a paw with both paws whilst laying down, she could feel if I tickled all 4 pads and would move her legs away and was still wagging her tail. Is sensation on the skin of the pads equivalent to deep pain sensation?
She arrived at the willows and after the assessment by the neurologist the situation seemed pretty bleak however the vet suggested an MRI and called us yesterday afternoon to say it’s IVDD, the ruptured disc is in her neck area and unless she deteriorates over the weekend he plans to do surgery through her neck on Monday. He’s explained this is a high risk surgery.
We are both distraught, we don’t know if Anya will survive the operation and if she does what we need to manage her at home. She weighs 50kg so she’s a big girl. Please if anyone has been in a similar situation and could give their insight, advice or just some words of encouragement I’d really appreciate it. I realise that’s a really long post so thank you if you made it this far xx
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Marjorie
Moderator~
Member since 2011. Surgery & Conservative
Posts: 5,724
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Post by Marjorie on May 31, 2020 5:17:44 GMT -7
Welcome to Dodgerslist, Jessica. So glad you’ve joined us all. We’ve got valuable information we’ve gleaned from the vets Dodgerslist consults with and our own experiences with IVDD since 2002 to share with you. **Disc disease is not a death sentence! ** Struggling with quality of life questions? Re-think things: www.dodgerslist.com/index/SDUNCANquality.htmWe've seen many, many dogs go through neck surgery and seldom see complications. The purpose of surgery is to take the pressure off of the spinal cord by removing the disc material causing the compression. Surgical decompression allows a normal blood supply to return to the compressed spinal cord and for neurologic recovery to begin. Deep pain sensation can be difficult to determine by tickling the pads of the feet. The fact that Anya can still wag her tail proves that she still has deep pain sensation. There's a lot of helpful information concerning surgery on these pages: www.dodgerslist.com/literature/healingsurgery.htmwww.dodgerslist.com/literature/surgery.htmAnya will need to be on 6-8 weeks of crate rest following surgery so you'll need to set up a recovery suite for her return. Super tried and true tips for setting up the recovery suite, the mattress and more! —> www.dodgerslist.com/literature/CrateRRP.htmSTRICT for a post-op dog means: ◼︎no laps ◼︎no couches ◼︎no baths ◼︎no sleeping with you ◼︎no chiro therapy whys: www.dodgerslist.com/literature/chiropractic.htm◼︎no dragging or meandering at potty times. Post-op dogs will follow surgeon's directives for PT during post-op rest as the offending disc material was surgically removed. If Anya does not have bladder control following surgery, you'll need to get a demonstration on how to manually express her bladder prior to leaving the hospital. Here's information on expressing for your review prior to the demonstration: www.dodgerslist.com/literature/Expressing.htmWith Anya being such a large dog, you'll have more of a challenge should she not have bladder control when released from the hospital. It is important that the amount of movement to the potty place be minimized until your surgeon directs otherwise. Try a pee pad right outside the crate. Train to use a pee pad by placing urine from Anya or another dog or dirt where they've gone on a pee pad and praise Anya when she goes on pee pad. Add caster wheels to a wire crate and wheel down ramp over steps to outside. Place recovery suite right near door. When Anya is released from the hospital, please let us know what meds she comes home on with the specific dosages in mgs and frequency given, how many weeks of post-op crate rest are prescribed and what PT is recommended. Knowledge is the power to fight the IVDD enemy and win!! The very best thing you can do for YOU, the caregiver, and for your dog is to get up to speed on IVDD soonest possible. Begin absorbing the must-have overall sense of meds, care and how the treatment works. Your dog will be depending on your ability to learn - excellent video series here: www.dodgerslist.com/literature/theater.htm PRINT OUT this link and tape to your fridge: www.dodgerslist.com/literature/healingpage.htm use the printout as your roadmap to avoid dangerous detours in your dog’s care make notes/highlight to keep yourself on track follow all the links in the next days to become the IVDD savvy pet parent your dog needs. Use the “search box” to easily locate topics over at our Main www.Dodgerslist.com website: www.dodgerslist.com/index/searchBOX.jpgThe guest board is a temporary Guest courtesy to get immediate help until you can register. I encourage you to register and login. That way all the features of the Forum are available to you, making it faster to reply and get an email alert about replies. It also makes is far easier for us to track your dog and give the best assistance. Illustrated what to expect during registration: www.dodgerslist.com/forumads/RegisterFORUM/register.htmHealing prayers for Anya. Please let us know of any questions or concerns. We're here for you and Anya and will help you through her recovery and onwards.
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Post by Jessica & Anya on May 31, 2020 14:26:11 GMT -7
Marjorie, I honestly cannot thank you enough for your message it was the much needed reassurance and support we needed at what I can’t honestly say has been one of the worst few days of my life. I’m delighted to tell you Anya has made it through surgery and is now recovering in ITU. I know that this is when the real hard work starts. With the help of all the resources you’ve shared with me I’m sure we can make it. Thank you again from the bottom of my heart. I’m so so grateful x
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Marjorie
Moderator~
Member since 2011. Surgery & Conservative
Posts: 5,724
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Post by Marjorie on May 31, 2020 16:33:03 GMT -7
Good to hear that Anya made it through surgery, Jessica. The surgery had been planned for Monday. Did Anya's condition worsen?
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Post by Jessica Lott on May 31, 2020 23:42:14 GMT -7
No she had improved! When we initially got to the hospital with Anya she was very anxious (she is quite an anxious girl anyway due to her experiences in her previous home). She was panting and salivating extensively. The vet felt that Anyas stomach breathing may have been related to nerves in her chest wall being affected. Our vet said he wanted to wait until Monday as this type of breathing makes the surgery more high risk and he wanted his colleagues on hand should he need them. I think once she relaxed overnight it was clear that her breathing was not affected therefore our vet was happy to carry out the surgery out of hours when the other neurosurgeons weren’t available. He called in the morning to say he was much happier with Anya and would like to go ahead.
I’ve registered on the forum as you suggested and have started reading through your links. I’m feeling really apprehensive at the moment but I’m sure we can get through this rehab phase with determination and an acceptance that it’s going to take a lot out of all of us x
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Post by Jessica & Anya on Jun 1, 2020 3:33:19 GMT -7
Hi Everyone,
Thanks for allowing me to join this forum. We are currently going through an awful time as i'm sure you can all appreciate.
Anya is our Black Russian Terrier. She weighs 50kg and is 7yrs 10 months old.
Medical History: Anya was diagnosed with arthritis is her right wrist in September last year. She also had a cyst that ruptured in the centre of her back in February of this year. Apart from that she is a little overweight but otherwise healthy. She is a very friendly, happy girl who loves to be with me, snoozing on the bed is her favourite pastime!
Medication: Metacam Current in hospital meds unknown
[Moderator's Note. Please do not edit 50kg [128 lbs. Metacam as of May 31: for arthritis needs Pepcid AC® (famotidine)]
History of IVDD: For the last 10 days Anya has been limping on her front left leg. We thought she must have overdone it on a walk and was having a flare up of her arthritis. We restarted her Metacam and she seemed happy in herself although she wouldn't come upstairs to bed and slept downstairs on her own. Thursday evening 28th May my husband said he thought Anya's back legs looked stiff but she was still mobile and in and out of the garden with us. Friday morning I got up to take Anya for a wee and she fell over trying to squat. I assumed it was that she was struggling because of her arthritis so arranged to collect her next bottle of Metacam from the vets. By the time I returned from the vets my husband told me Anya had collapsed trying to get to the front door. When we supported her up we noticed she was knuckling on her left hind leg. We took her straight to the vets who kept her in for the afternoon and told us they felt it was neurological and referred Anya to a local animal hospital that specialises in Neurology. Saturday we took Anya to the hospital where she had an MRI.
Diagnosis: Following the MRI the vet called us to say that Anya had a 'slipped disc' in her neck. At this point she was knuckling o her front left and hind left legs. She could still wag her tail and could feel if I stroked the pads on both front and rear paws and could give both front paws when asked. She could not stand independently. Anya is quite an anxious dog and was panting quite heavily when she was with the vet. He told us that this concerned him as she seemed to be breathing from her belly and not her chest and this could indicate damage to the nerves in her chest wall. He advised decompression surgery at this point but said due to her breathing it was high risk and he would rather wait until Monday to perform the surgery. We agreed.
Surgery: Our neurology vet called us Sunday Morning to say he was happy with Anya's improvement overnight, her breathing was normal and as such he would like to do the surgery that day. The surgery was performed by both our neurologist and an orthopaedic surgeon successfully and he was happy that all the protruding material had been removed. Anya was moved to ITU and when I called for a nursing update last night Anya was sedated and they were going to try her with some dinner a little later.
Day 1 Post Surgery: Today [Monday, June 1] I feel as though I have been hit with a sledgehammer. The surgeon called this morning to say that Anya's neurological function has deteriorated. She had experienced diarrhoea overnight and would not eat. She now cannot use her back legs at all.
I think I was so optimistic after she made it through surgery, I knew we had a lot of long rehab to do but I just wasn't prepared to hear that she had got worse. Has anyone else experienced this and is there any hope? I know I can't allow such a big dog to live in a wheelchair, her front legs won't support her. Due to Coronavirus we aren't allowed to go and see Anya so I can't even go and offer her comfort. I'm absolutely heartbroken. I had looked at the grading of IVDD and believed Anya was in the middle group with good chances of success as her tail wagging meant she still had deep pain sensation but now I just feel lost and confused. any help would be really appreciated.
Thank you,
Jessica
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Marjorie
Moderator~
Member since 2011. Surgery & Conservative
Posts: 5,724
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Post by Marjorie on Jun 1, 2020 4:13:10 GMT -7
Just take it one day at a time, Jessica. Try not to look ahead too much or expect too much too soon. Nerves are very slow to heal but they can heal. Any idea how long she'll remain at the hospital? Here's Dodgerslist page about what to expect discharge day. www.dodgerslist.com/literature/surgery.htm#dischargeHere is a list of questions to ask on discharge day, too. www.dodgerslist.com/literature/dischargequestions.htmHere's our page on post-op exercises that you can run past the surgeon to see if there are any he'll approve and when they can be started. www.dodgerslist.com/literature/massagepassiveexercises.htmAcupuncture and laser light therapy are helpful treatments that can be very beneficial to assist with re-establishment of nerve connections in the body and usually can be started right away if within your budget. www.dodgerslist.com/literature/healingacupuncture.htmAlso water therapy can be performed after the stitches/sutures are removed. Some of these exercises can be done right in the bathtub. Please check with the surgeon before starting any of these. www.dodgerslist.com/literature/watertherapy.htmNeuropathic pain is not common but is something you should be aware of. This kind of pain is abnormal, phantom pain sensations with severe spinal cord damage. Signs are obsessive licking of paw, leg, genitals, tail. Escalates to biting, life-threatening chewing off parts. Immediately put on an e-collar (or lengthwise folded towel around neck and duct taped closed) to prevent access to lower body. Contact vet immediately for Gabapentin or stronger Lyrica (pregabalin) for neuropathic pain. More info: www.dodgerslist.com/literature/neuropathy.pdfPlease keep us up to date on her status. Stay strong, stay positive and never give up hope!
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Post by Jessica & Anya on Jun 1, 2020 6:18:29 GMT -7
We haven't been given any indication how long she will be in hospital. Our vet said he will call again to update us. I just am totally distraught. Is it normal to see deterioration after surgery? I am feeling really catastrophic at the moment and i'm struggling to do anything but think about her getting worse and not being able to say goodbye.
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PaulaM
Moderator.
Member since 2007: surgery, conservative . Montana, USA
Posts: 19,928
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Post by PaulaM on Jun 1, 2020 6:33:10 GMT -7
Jessica, it is pretty normal that the surgery itself will cause swollen tissue much like when you cut yourself that area becomes swollen and painful. The surgery temporary setback in neuro function caused by the swelling usually subsides in about 14 days and then one can best see the direction of nerve healing. The diarrhea hopefully has already been addressed by the surgeon by the use of two different types of stomach protectors. Famotidine to suppress acid production and sucralfate. to bandaid over the damaged areas of the stomach lining. Good idea to be up to speed on each med your dog takes or will take at the Mar Vista Vet Drug Directory here: www.marvistavet.com/pharmacy-center.pmlThere are multiple factors involved in causing extra stomach acids that will typically happen during a disc episode. 1- Stress can increase stomach acids. Dogs are creatures of routine. Change of being at the hospital, the stress of a surgical procedure could contribute to increase of stomach acids. 2- The use of any anti-inflammatory drug such as Metacam can increase stomach acids. 3- Spinal cord damage can inhibit the autonomic function that normally protects the stomach lining. Dogs do not speak up at first signs like a person would, so best to be proactive in stomach protection when Metacam is in use and a disc episode going on. As your get updated, please let us know how Anya is doing.
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Post by Jessica & Anya on Jun 1, 2020 7:14:44 GMT -7
Thank you all so much, I have just called to ask for an update on Anya and the news is much better. She is wagging her tail and the nurse said they they are turning her regularly but when they go back an hour later she has moved herself onto her other side. The vet has just called whilst I was typing this and he said Anya is now better than when she arrived at hospital and tried to stand up when he entered her kennel x
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PaulaM
Moderator.
Member since 2007: surgery, conservative . Montana, USA
Posts: 19,928
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Post by PaulaM on Jun 1, 2020 7:19:48 GMT -7
Jessica, wow! very good news..on attempting to stand up and ability to reposition her body. Thank your for sharing the good news!
how's the diarrhea this morning?
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Post by Jessica & Anya on Jun 1, 2020 7:51:38 GMT -7
Thank you for being so caring and responsive. No further diarrhoea and she has had a bath to clean her up after the episode last night. If i'm not sent home with Pepcid AC is it something I can buy without prescription?
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PaulaM
Moderator.
Member since 2007: surgery, conservative . Montana, USA
Posts: 19,928
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Post by PaulaM on Jun 1, 2020 9:30:59 GMT -7
In the UK Pepcid AC® (famotidine) is an Rx item. So do discuss with your vet if Metacam is to continue at home. Do read the link about famotidine and why it is preferable to the over the counter older generation stomach protectors you could get w/o prescription in the UK. LINK: marvistavet.com/famotidine.pml
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Post by Jessica & Anya on Jun 3, 2020 12:56:54 GMT -7
Hi, I wanted to give you a pretty incredible update. We are now three days post surgery. We were told we could collect Anya from the hospital this afternoon. Anya walked out of the hospital unaided in a chest harness only. She has full bowel and bladder control, is using all 4 limbs pretty well and is delighted to be home. The vets notes say the following “Anya is ambulatory without assistance. There was a mild degree of paresis and proprioceptive ataxia of the thoracic limbs but none in the pelvic limbs. Anya is comfortable and her surgical wound is healing nicely”.
Anyas discharge medications are: Gabapentin 400mg 3x daily Paracetamol 500mg 2x daily Cephalexin 1200mg 2x daily
She is allowed 3-4 ten minute walks on a chest harness and has a follow up appointment booked in 4 weeks time. I’m over the moon but also feeling frightened everything is going too well!
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Post by Romy & Frankie on Jun 3, 2020 13:14:31 GMT -7
Anya is doing very well so soon after surgery. Being up and walking is wonderful.
For post-surgery dogs, short walks are a common type of PT. She should be in her recovery suite when not on her walks. Crate rest for dogs who have had surgery is to allow the surgical incisions to heal.
There is no need to be frightened. Some dogs just do really well after surgery. Anya seems to be one of those. Just continue with the walking and crate rest as directed by your surgeon.
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Post by Jessica & Anya on Jun 10, 2020 8:59:47 GMT -7
Hi, Anya is still doing well at home, her antibiotics and paracetamol have now stopped (last dose this morning so no missed doses at this point). She’s been doing her 4 very short walks to go to the toilet and apart from that spends most of her time resting on her bed. Yesterday I thought she may not be properly weight bearing on her front left leg (the same leg that her IVDD symptoms began in).
This afternoon we got her up to do her walk and she was clearly limping on the front left leg. Once she had walked for around 30 seconds she began weight bearing on the leg again and was walking well by the end of her 4 minute toilet break. I’m really panicking about this limping and have called the hospital to ask for advice. My husband is being much more pragmatic and thinks it’s probably normal to be up and down so soon after surgery. I wondered if anyone could advise of this can happen or if I’m right to be worried and should be looking to take her back into hospital? Thanks so much.
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PaulaM
Moderator.
Member since 2007: surgery, conservative . Montana, USA
Posts: 19,928
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Post by PaulaM on Jun 10, 2020 11:41:47 GMT -7
Jessica, sounds a bit like maybe being at first stiff from being lying down. Usually that and things like arthritis, once getting moving, it helps. Please let us know what the hospital thinks it might be.
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Post by Jessica & Anya on Sept 12, 2023 10:52:28 GMT -7
Hi, it feels strange writing here, especially after reading through my previous posts. I am writing to say thank you, over three years after Anya’s IVDD diagnosis she is here with us, walking around as if nothing ever happened. She’s an old girl now at almost 11, we feel incredibly lucky to have been given the chance to spend all this extra time with her. Our experience with IVDD remains one of the most traumatic experiences I’ve ever had, it was absolutely devastating but this forum gave me hope, comfort and a sense of control at the worst of times. The kindness you showed and the speedy responses provided much needed reassurance and understanding. I’ll always remember your kindness and hope you know the tremendous difference you make to people. Thank you so much, Jess and Anya x
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Post by Romy & Frankie on Sept 12, 2023 13:03:59 GMT -7
We really love updates here at Dodgerslist. So happy to hear that Anya is doing well.
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PaulaM
Moderator.
Member since 2007: surgery, conservative . Montana, USA
Posts: 19,928
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Post by PaulaM on Sept 12, 2023 18:49:49 GMT -7
Jessica, what a wonderful update. Just makes my day to hear how well Anya is doing and that we played a roll in helping you! Thank you for sharing. Hey, if you can, consider helping us extend our IVDD education boundaries. When in conversation at the grocery store line or wherever you may meet breeds most prone to IVDD (Dachshunds, Beagles, Poodles, Spaniels, Shih Tzus, Pekingese, and Chihuahuas, Frenchies) give out our free little wallet cards. Hand carry our literature and print out our letter of introduction for your vet. ► ORDER BROCHURES & cards, they're free!◀︎ for your vet and wallet cards for you
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