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Post by pnthompso on Jul 19, 2013 17:34:42 GMT -7
--What is your dog's name? Shiloh
--What breed is your dog and did you specifically get a diagnosis of IVDD? Corgi. Yes.
-- What was the date you saw the vet and started 100% STRICT crate rest 24/7? Incident happened evening of June 25 and medicine started. Saw the vet June 26, 2013.
-- Is there still currently pain - shivering, trembling, yelping when picked up or moved, reluctant/slow to move head or body, tight hard tummy? Yelping when picked up or moved. Some shivering and trembling. Holds head up, reluctant to lay down head. Tight hard tummy. Red and swollen penis. Bit off to toenails.
-- What are the exact names of meds currently given, their doses in mgs and frequencies? Prednisone – 10mg twice a day Tramadol – 25 mg three times a day Methocarbomol – 250 mg once a day Diazepam – 2.5 mg twice a day Gabapentin – 100mg three times a day Pepcid – 20 mg twice a day
Herbs: Double P II – one capsule twice a day Concentrated Hindquarter Weakness – one capsule twice a day
Homeopathic: Discus compositum – half tablet, 2-4 times a day
Restorin ointment – 3 times a day
-- Currently can your dog wobbly walk? move the legs at all? or wag the tail when you do some happy talk? Completely down and no tail wagging.
-- Do you find wet bedding or leaks on you when lifted up? Wets bedding or pees when trying to move to go outside.
-- Eating and drinking OK? Yes
-- Poops OK - normal color no dark or bright red blood? Very constipated.
This is very long winded but here are all the details…Shiloh is a 6 year old corgi. His first disc episode was in January of 2013 while we were on vacation and his grandma was watching him. She took him to the vet right away and got him on prednisone and pain meds but he was completely down in the back and was incontinent for a short period. We started 8 weeks of crate rest and within a week of getting him back to our home he could stand up on his own to drink water and within a few more days could take wobbly steps. He also received acupuncture for a couple weeks while he was on crate rest. At the end of the 8 weeks he could walk, was still a bit wobbly but was continually improving his walking. We were thrilled.
On the evening of June 25 it became apparent that Shiloh was having another disc episode. We immediately crated him and still had medication left from his last episode so we started the prednisone, tramadol and methocarbamol again (see doses above). We took him to his regular vet the next day who confirmed that it was another disc. At that time he still had deep pain sensation and was still able to move his back legs somewhat when walking with the sling but his toes were curling a bit. He could also still wag his little corgi nub. We were very bummed that we were going down this road again so shortly after his last episode but felt confident that he would recover. We immediately called his holistic vet to set up more acupuncture but could not get an appointment until the next week. In the meantime Shiloh’s pain was not being controlled with the pain medications. He was shaking and yelping when being picked up. Also he stopped moving his back legs and all and when walking in the sling his back toes would drag in the grass. He was also extremely constipated (causing him to strain when trying to go and even more pain) even though we had been feeding him some plain pumpkin with his watered down kibble. There was one or two nights where he was in really bad shape so we gave him another tramadol. We took him to our regular vet said that there was not much else they could do but gave him a doggie “morphine” shot (can’t remember the exact name of it) and hoped that acupuncture would help. Once seen by the holistic vet she could tell he was in extreme pain but tried to do as much acupuncture as she could. She put him on some herbs and Valium, and said she would come back two more times that week. Even after the first acupuncture there was a noticeable difference, he seemed more like himself. After the 3rd session that week he seemed to be in no pain-he wasn’t helping any more and seemed much happier. Things were really looking up!
Unfortunately she did not have any openings this week. This past Wednesday we noticed that Shiloh’s penis looked very red and inflamed so we took him into his regular vet. They thought that the sling we were using (we were using a neck tie) was putting too much pressure on that area and gave us Resortin cream to put on him twice a day. We switched to using an ace bandage as a sling. He started dribbling pee more in his pen and seemed to tense up when we got ready to pick him up. He started yelping again when being picked up, we think because in the process we would put our arm under his sheath to pick him up. Late Wednesday night/early Thursday morning we woke up to see Shiloh lying in a pool of blood. He (unbeknownst to us before this) has neuropathic pain and chewed off two of his claws on one foot down to stumps. There was a lot of blood but luckily we had a styptic pencil and got the bleeding to stop after about an hour. We took him to the vet the next day to get bandaged up (luckily he only chewed his claws and no flesh). They prescribed gabapentin to help him with the neuropathic pain.
Despite all of these medications, today Shiloh is still yelping and whines when he is picked up. He still knows he needs to go outside to pee, but in the process of trying to scoot himself toward the front of the crate he pees and squeals and yelps as we pick him up. Once outside he tries to turn around and walk back inside without peeing or pooping. Also when we try to express his bladder he sometimes yelps out in pain. Today he seems very painful, with heavy breathing, refusing to lay his head down, continued yelping when picked up. Given the amount of remedies he has received and given that he has almost been on crate rest for a month without much long-term improvement we are just unsure how long to extend this process in the hope that he will heal, especially since he seems to still be extremely painful. We love our little guy to pieces and want to keep him around but we are losing hope and any suggestions would be greatly appreciated. Thank you!
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Post by Pauliana on Jul 19, 2013 20:02:44 GMT -7
Hi Paul and Katie, welcome to Dodgerslist.
So sorry to hear that Shiloh is in such pain.. I would recommend taking him to your local Emergency Vet right away.. The heavy breathing is very concerning as well as the fact that his pain is not under control, despite all the medications. I am praying they can do something to help him. Don't wait, get him to the ER!
Sending lots of hugs your way..
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PaulaM
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Member since 2007: surgery, conservative . Montana, USA
Posts: 19,928
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Post by PaulaM on Jul 19, 2013 20:09:55 GMT -7
He is being under medicated for pain meds likely depending on his weight. Methocarbamol can be given 3 x a day and there is room to move with increased mg of the tramadol at 3 times a day. Discuss also getting a pain shot at the clinic to help to get pain back under control quickly
Is surgery an option for your family? It sound like has a neck disc, is that what the vet diagnosed?
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Post by pnthompso on Jul 20, 2013 10:36:03 GMT -7
Thank you for the replies! We didn't see them until earlier this morning but Shiloh is doing much better at the moment. There was only one brief yelp when getting picked up first thing this morning but none since and he is laying his head down to rest.
He weighs about 28 pounds-we inquired about increasing the pain meds but our vet was in surgery so we are waiting for a call back. We gave him two gabapentin last night (200 mg total) and this morning.
Surgery is unfortunately not an option for us. The vet mentioned that she thought this disc was one right next to the one he injured in January (lower back, near to the area right over his hips).
We are holding out hope that maybe with a bit more tweaking of the pain meds we can get him 100% out of pain!
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PaulaM
Moderator.
Member since 2007: surgery, conservative . Montana, USA
Posts: 19,928
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Post by PaulaM on Jul 20, 2013 10:50:33 GMT -7
Paul, so glad to hear pain is being control much better. At his weight Tramadol could be increased in the mg dose to the full 50mg tablet… ask the vet…. and do discuss the range of options for dose in mg and how often to give each of the pain meds. That way on a weekend day or night you have a plan in hand rather than rushing to an expensive ER vet should pain surface nearing next dose of pain meds. Key is getting pain fully under control dose to dose, so Shiloh can work on all the repair jobs to heal. Is his nail biting stopped with the gabapentin? Read up on gabapentin and then discuss with your vet about your having increased the dose last night to further your understanding of this med: Gabapentin possesses nonlinear pharmacokinetics; bioavailability decreases with increasing dose; plasma levels plateau vasg.org/g_drugs.htm#GABAPWhat are the active ingredients in the Resortin Cream, I could not find it on-line?
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Post by pnthompso on Jul 20, 2013 10:57:58 GMT -7
The nail biting his seemed to stopped...we have been putting an e-collar on him when we are not home.
The ingredients of the Resortin are...Nystatin 100,000 units, Neomycin Sulfate 2.5 mg, Thiostrepton 2,500 units, Triamcinolone Acetonide 1 mg, in a polyethylene and mineral oil gel base. The cream does not seem to be helping much, his area is still pretty red. When we get the call back we will ask about something else for this and about the gabapentin.
Thank you!
5 hours later: We missed a call back from our vets office (but not from the vet he normally sees) but they left a voicemail stating not to give him any extra gabapentin. They also said not to give any extra tramadol becaus he was already on the max dose. She also said she didn't have any other main management ideas besides injectibles.
We ended up giving him an extra tramadol and he is resting well now. I don't really believe that he was on the max dose and really he doesn't have a lot to lose at this point. Is it usually better to increase the mgs given every 8 hours or keep it the same amount but give it 4 times a day?
Also when we took him outside a little bit ago he sniffed a pole and then peed!
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PaulaM
Moderator.
Member since 2007: surgery, conservative . Montana, USA
Posts: 19,928
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Post by PaulaM on Jul 20, 2013 16:37:15 GMT -7
I'm glad you do see his pain is now under control and no more nail biting too!. Very good news too on proof that he does have bladder control with that sniff and pee….. Yay!!! Paul, can you find another vet who will support you though this disc episode. An IVDD vet does know that pain control is a must and often it needs to be aggressive. The vet that believed Tramadol was maxed out is clearly not comfortable with IVDD. It makes a world of difference to have an IVDD knowledgeable vet. More on finding one: www.dodgerslist.com/literature/VetchkList.htm Is there an indication of when prednisone will start being tapered down? This is when it is important to assess for pain, comunicate at once to the vet because pred would need to be used a bit longer. You will need a vet who is comfortable in treating this disc episode not just with pain meds but with the anti-inflammatory too.
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Post by pnthompso on Jul 26, 2013 8:21:56 GMT -7
We have a sad update....this past Tuesday we made the difficult decision to send Shiloh to the rainbow bridge. His pain was very up and down, one day he would be good and one day would be bad even after increasing the pain meds. It was hurting him each time we needed to pick him up. It was heartbreaking. We had decided beforehand that if it was time then we would like his acupuncture vet (who he loved) to do it at home instead of taking into his least favorite place-his normal vet. He had an acupuncture appointment on Tuesday and we decided that if she felt like acupuncture could help get his pain under control enough to finally start healing that we and he would keep going. When she attempted to begin the appointment Shiloh scooted himself away and sat with his back turned (which he had never done before). She could tell that he was in a lot of pain and she also said that he had some liquid in his lungs. We felt like it was time and he seemed to know it too. He was only 6. It has been very difficult. The house is very quiet.
Thank you for the responses on here. We wish everyone the best of luck with their dogs' recovery.
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StevieLuv
Helpful Member
Conservative Treatment 3x. It really does work!
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Post by StevieLuv on Jul 26, 2013 9:26:33 GMT -7
I am so sorry for your loss. The hardest and most loving thing we do for our furkids is to help them across the Bridge when the time comes. Run fast and pain free Shiloh, you will be together again someday.(((hugs)))
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Post by Sally & Vinnie on Jul 26, 2013 10:30:55 GMT -7
I am so sorry for your loss. Saying a prayer of comfort and peace your way.
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Sabrina
Helpful Member
My Charley-dog, a Dodger'sList grad enjoying life!
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Post by Sabrina on Jul 26, 2013 10:48:56 GMT -7
So sorry for your loss.
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Post by Jane & Seiji on Jul 26, 2013 11:05:58 GMT -7
Very sorry to hear of your loss. Rest in peace, Shiloh.
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Marjorie
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Member since 2011. Surgery & Conservative
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Post by Marjorie on Jul 26, 2013 11:28:10 GMT -7
My sincerest condolences on your loss. I know how hard it is to lose a beloved pet. My heart goes out to you.
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PaulaM
Moderator.
Member since 2007: surgery, conservative . Montana, USA
Posts: 19,928
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Post by PaulaM on Jul 26, 2013 12:43:14 GMT -7
I'm so sorry about the sad news and your loss.
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Post by Nancy & Polly on Jul 26, 2013 17:15:30 GMT -7
I am so sorry to hear of your loss of Shiloh. I know you did your very best for him.
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Post by Pauliana on Jul 26, 2013 17:27:37 GMT -7
Paul and Katie, I am so sad to hear about Shiloh and send sympathy and hugs your way..
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kimkiernan
New Member
Poppy walking well and gaining strength. Able to walk 30 minutes now.
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Post by kimkiernan on Jul 30, 2013 1:38:42 GMT -7
I'm so sad to hear of Shiloh passing.
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Dachshund
New Member
Always look up for help
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Post by Dachshund on Jul 30, 2013 7:40:23 GMT -7
I'm real sorry for your loss I know what it's like to lose a family member.
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Post by lovekelseylove on Aug 3, 2013 20:18:32 GMT -7
I'm sorry to hear about Shiloh. He is pain-free now. Sending sympathy to you and your family.
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Post by jochs311 on Aug 3, 2013 21:54:32 GMT -7
So sorry to hear about Shiloh. Prayers sent your way. Stay strong.
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