Lisa's Crissy 6/29 Conservative Beagle

Welcome to Dodgerslist. What's your name and your beagle's?

With details I'd better be able to comment.... see the questions below.

So for now just general statements. If the prednisone was recently tapered and stopped that can be the reason for worsening neuro functions. She could also have possibly been moving too much and relapsed the early healing disc that takes 8 weeks of limited movement to heal.

YOur vet needs to know about the worsening (what exactly it means: pain, more diminishment of neuro functions???)

Often it takes being at the anti-inflammatory dose of prednisone (5mg 2x/day) for 7-30 days before all the swelling is gone. When the vet guesses swelling might be gone there will be a taper. The dose is lowered to less than the anti-flammatory dose your job at home would be to assess just how well reduction of swelling is going by observing for any hint of pain or diminishment of nerve functions. To have a clear picture on a taper, pain meds are also stopped or backed off too.

Rule of thumb is: pain = swelling = more time on Pred, pain meds and Pepcid AC is needed.

If there is no pain on the taper then it goes to completion. Then no meds at all are needed. Disc healing will continue for the remainder of the 8 weeks. Nerves can continue to self heal…think in terms of months.


QUESTIONS ab out your dog:
--What is your dog's name and yours?

--What breed is your dog and did you specifically get a diagnosis of IVDD?

-- What was the date you saw the vet and started the all important 8 weeks of 100% STRICT crate rest 24/7 only out to potty …. No laps, no couch, no sleeping in bed with you, no meandering, scooting or dragging around during potty times. No baths, no chiro (aka VOM)?

-- Is there still currently pain - shivering, trembling, yelping when picked up or moved, reluctant/slow to move head or body, tight hard tummy?

-- How much does your dog weigh? Would you give us a list of exact med names currently given, their doses in mg's and frequencies? At what date did Pred start and what date did it taper/stop?

-- Eating and drinking OK? How are poops today- normal color and firmness, no dark or bright red blood?

-- Currently can your dog wobbly walk? move the legs at all? or wag the tail when you do some happy talk? Keep in mind the very, very lightest least aggressive range of motion and leg massage will be necessary for paralyzed legs during conservative treatment once off all pain meds and no more signs of pain The information highlighted in PINK pertains to a dog who can't walk .
www.dodgerslist.com/literature/massagepassiveexercises.htm

-- Do you find wet bedding or leaks on you when lifted up?

-- If there is pain or neuro diminishment, dogs can benefit greatly with acupuncture or laser light therapy. These therapies can be be started right away to help relieve pain and to also to kick start energy production in nerve cells to sprout. So if this therapy is in your budget, seek out a holistic vet.
ahvma.org/Widgets/FindVet.html
www.serenityvetacupuncture.com/index.php/faq_/ [one vet's overview/prices] Chiropractic is not recommended for IVDD dogs.

Lisa, we're going to need specifics as to the reason why Crissy has been off and on pred for a couple of years now. Was it a low dose due to the fact that she was never able to taper off due to return of pain? Was she treated with 8 full weeks of crate rest, anti-inflammatory and pain meds for the first disc episode years ago? Please give us more specifics about her condition the past two years since she was first diagnosed with IVDD.

Conservative treatment for a ruptured/torn disc is 8 full weeks of strict 100% 24/7 crate rest, an anti-flammatory to reduce the swelling and pain meds to address the pain. You did exactly right getting her into the crate to protect her spine from further damage. 100% STRICT crate rest 24/7 only out to potty for a full 8 weeks is the SINGLE most important thing you can do to help your dog-- it is the hallmark component of conservative treatment. Carried in and out to potty. No laps, no couch, no sleeping in bed with you, no meandering, scooting or dragging around during potty times. No baths, no chiro (aka VOM). In other words do everything you can to limit the vertebrae in the back from moving and putting pressure on the bad disc.
www.dodgerslist.com/literature/CrateRRP.htm

Crissy's pain is not fully under control yet. There should be no sign of pain from one dose of pain meds to the next and pain should be fully under control within one hour after the first dose of pain meds. Please contact your vet ASAP to discuss adjusting the pain meds to bring Crissy's pain under control.

Crissy also needs an anti-inflammatory to bring the swelling of the disc down. Please speak to your vet about prescribing an anti-inflammatory ASAP. The swelling is pressing on Crissy's spine and is causing the pain and can cause nerve damage.

Once an anti-inflammatory is prescribed, Pepcid AC should be given to protect your dog from the excess acid produced by the anti-inflammatory. Please get your vet's permission to give 5 mg of Pepcid AC (generic is famotidine) 30 minutes before the dose of the anti-inflammatory and thereafter every 12 hours). Phrase the question to your vet in this particular way: "Is there any medical reason my dog may not take Pepcid AC?" If your vet says your dog has no health issues such as liver, heart, etc to keep her from taking Pepcid AC, then do get it on board.

Once we hear back from you as to Crissy's history with IVDD and her present meds (with mgs and frequency given), we'll be better able to support you. And please let us know what your vet says after speaking to him today.

Healing prayers for Crissy.

Yes, Prednisone does cause increased thirst and urination so she will need to be carried out to do potty every 3-4 hours. I'm glad to hear that she's doing well in that area with no wet bedding.

Please let us know what the dosage of the Robaxin, Tramadol and Pepcid AC is. Tramadol works best when given consistently every 8 hours and not as needed. You don't want to see pain resurface before giving it. Pain should be completely under control as it hinders healing.

Here is our information on calcification: www.dodgerslist.com/literature/CalcifiedDiscs.htm

Since you said this was the first time Crissy had wobbly legs, I assume that the other times the symptoms were only of pain? Any time a dog has a ruptured or torn disc and exhibits pain and/or neuro deficits and conservative care is implemented, there must be a full 8 weeks of crate rest, plus the anti-inflammatory, pain meds and Pepcid AC. Too much movement and the disc won't heal and form the necessary scar tissue or can re-tear and the dog can then exhibit pain again and be back to square one. Hopefully, with the full 8 weeks of crate rest this time, she'll be able to taper off of the steroid without signs of pain returning. If you do see signs of pain returning at any time during the taper, you must immediately notify your vet so Crissy can be returned to the original anti-inflammatory dose of the steroid. Pain = swelling = more time on all meds.

How are you doing carrying her in and out to do potty? I know I had trouble lifting my Jeremy, a cocker spaniel weighing about 28 lbs. If you're using a wire crate, you can add castor wheels and wheel her to the door or down a ramp to her potty area. Or if she'll go on a pee pad, you can place a pad right outside of her crate. Let us know if you're having any difficulty with that as it's very important to limit the amount of steps that Crissy is taking to protect her spine from further damage. Here's the correct way to lift an IVDD dog: 
www.dodgerslist.com/literature/liftcarry.jpg