|
Post by Kristin & Dexter on Dec 3, 2019 22:56:32 GMT -7
Hello, I am new to this board and new to dealing with IVDD. Our 5 year old pembroke welsh corgi, Dexter (30 pounds) went down on Tuesday, November 26th at around 10:00pm. We rushed him to an emergency vet immediately, where it was determined that he had likely herniated a disc, but this could not be confirmed via MRI, as that clinic did not have a machine. At that point he had no use of his hind legs but was still presenting with what they thought may be deep pain sensation, as he was withdrawing limbs but not acknowledging toe pinch. We were given a few options, and chose to attempt conservative therapy and left him at the vet overnight for IV anti-inflammatories and pain medication.
We were contacted the morning of November 26th and advised that he has lost the deep pain sensation he has the previous evening and needed surgery as soon as possible. That clinic then set up a transfer to another local clinic that DID have a neurologist and we transferred him.
We arrived at the second clinic at around 11am and they took him back immediately for the MRI to confirm a herniated disc. We spoke with the doctor, who is a DVM, MS, DACVIM and board certified and he advise that with surgery he had a 50/50 chance at full recovery.
An hour later they called to confirm the suspicion of herniated disc and we approved surgery immediately. Dexter’s final diagnosis was “intervertebral disk herniation, acute disk extrusion L2-3” and was treated with “hemilaminectomy, L1-4, right < spinal decompression”.
He is currently 6 days post-op and has not regained use of his hind legs or deep pain sensation. He is on strict rest in a small open-top with a bed and dog pads for 4 weeks. We are expressing his bladder but he also appears to leak and sometimes just urinate fully in his pen. Currently he is on 5mg of prednisone every 12 hours and 1mg of prazosin every 8 hours to relax his bladder, so we are hoping that at least part of his incontinence is being caused by a mixture of medication that increases thirst/urination along with medication that relaxes his bladder. He is pooping what appears to normal (non-bloody) poop, however it is quite hard so we started giving him some pumpkin last night to help with that. He is eating and drinking like normal and has definitely not lost interest in food.
[Moderator's note: please do not edit 30 lbs. Prednisone as of 11/27: 5mg 2x/day for 5 days before tapering Gabapentin 100 mg 3x/day omeprazole 10gmgs 2x/day]
As his staples have not yet been removed we have been instructed that his only PT should be passive range of motion exercises, massage of the limbs, and standing/short walks assisted with a sling.
I have seen so many stories and articles with different odds of full recovery in the situation Dexter was in and I think at this point I’m just upsetting myself more by reading this things. The fact that he’s made no positive improvement is, despite my knowledge that these recoveries can take weeks months or even years, has me crying most nights and I finally decided to get advise and stories from people that have lived this. Any encouragement is wonderful.
He seems to also be depressed. As I said, he has not lost interest in food or water but he just doesn’t seem as excited as he was before. He is currently also taking 100mg of gabapentin every 8 hours, so I know part of that could just be the pain medication. Is there anything that I can do to help cheer him up?
|
|
Marjorie
Moderator~
Member since 2011. Surgery & Conservative
Posts: 5,724
|
Post by Marjorie on Dec 4, 2019 7:50:47 GMT -7
Welcome to Dodgerslist, Kristin. So glad you’ve joined us all. We’ve got valuable information we’ve gleaned from the vets Dodgerslist consults with and our own experiences with IVDD since 2002 to share with you! **Disc disease is not a death sentence!**Struggling with quality of life questions? Re-think things: www.dodgerslist.com/index/SDUNCANquality.htmIt will help us work together with you and avoid offering ideas that could cause harm or lead the discussion in the wrong direction delaying help for your dog — please share a bit more detail with us: ❖1 Is there still currently pain? ☐shivering, trembling ☐yelping when picked up or moved ☐reluctant to move much in crate such as shift positions or slow to move ☐tight tense tummy ☐can’t find a comfortable position ☐Arched back ☐ Holding front or back leg flamingo style not wanting to bear weight ☐head held high or nose to the ground ☐Not their normal perky selves? Full pain relief is expected in 1 hour and stays that way dose to dose. If not in control your vet needs to know asap to adjust meds. Neuropathic pain is not common but is something that you should be aware of. This kind of pain is abnormal, phantom pain sensations with severe spinal cord damage. Signs are obsessive licking of paw, leg, genitals, tail. Escalates to biting, life-threatening chewing off parts. Immediately put on an e-collar (or lengthwise folded towel around neck and duct taped closed) to prevent access to lower body. Contact vet immediately for Gabapentin or stronger Lyrica (pregabalin) for neuropathic pain. More info: www.dodgerslist.com/literature/neuropathy.pdf❖2 What is the date of the Prednisone taper? PEPCID AC: Anytime a dog is on an anti-inflammatory, stomach protector must be given to protect against the serious side effects of the anti-inflammatory. Ask if your dog has any health issues to prevent use of Pepcid AC (famotidine)? (doesn't need it, we wait til there is problem…are NOT answers to your question!) If you get a "no health" issues answer,then go to the grocery store to purchase over the counter Pepcid AC containing one single active ingredient (famotidine). Doxie weight dogs: 5mg Pepcid (famotidine) every 12 hours. NOTE: Pepcid AC (famotidine) for dogs is 0.44mg per pound, 30 mins before the anti-inflammatory and thereafter every 12 hours for as long as your dog is on the anti-inflammatory. www.1800petmeds.com/Famotidine-prod11171.html canigivemydog.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/10/can-i-give-my-dog-pepcid-ac-300x300.jpg❖3 Post-op crate rest is to allow the surgical sites to heal. Super tried and true tips for setting up the recovery suite, the mattress and more! —> www.dodgerslist.com/literature/CrateRRP.htmSTRICT for a post-op dog means: ◼︎no laps ◼︎no couches ◼︎no baths ◼︎no sleeping with you ◼︎no chiro therapy whys: www.dodgerslist.com/literature/chiropractic.htm◼︎no dragging or meandering at potty times. Post-op dogs will follow surgeon's directives for PT during post-op rest as the offending disc material was surgically removed. Acupuncture or laser light therapy can be be started right away as an adjunct to pain meds and to kick start nerve cell energy production. Options: Acupuncture vet who does home visits to avoid back moving during transports. For transport to necessary visits, pad out the recovery suite extra space with a rolled up towel/blanket to prevent body shifts during braking or cornering. CAUTIONS: ~~ Laser light therapy is contra-indicated with tumors which are detected via x-ray. ~~ Why Chiropractic is not recommended for IVDD dogs: www.dodgerslist.com/literature/chiropractic.htmAlso water therapy can be performed after the stitches/sutures are removed. Some of these exercises can be done right in the bathtub. Many members have found underwater treadmills to be very helpful in regaining their dogs' use of their legs. Please check with the surgeon before starting any of these. www.dodgerslist.com/literature/watertherapy.htm❖5 Learning how to express the bladder can take some time. While on Prednisone, Dexter's bladder should be expressed every 2-3 hours to avoid overflowing of the bladder, which is what is happening when you find wet bedding. Did you get a hands-on-your hands demonstration by the hospital? Review video for helpful tips: www.dodgerslist.com/literature/Expressing.htmKnowledge is the power to fight the IVDD enemy and win!!The very best thing you can do for YOU, the caregiver, and for your dog is to get up to speed on IVDD as soon as possible. Begin absorbing the must-have overall sense of meds, care and how the treatment works. Your dog will be depending on your ability to learn: www.dodgerslist.com/literature/theater.htm --- PRINT OUT this link and tape to your fridge: www.dodgerslist.com/literature/healingpage.htm --- use the printout as your roadmap to avoid dangerous detours in your dog's care --- make notes/highlight to keep yourself on track --- follow all the links in the next days to become the IVDD savvy pet parent your dog needs. Use the “search box” to easily locate topics over at our Main www.dodgerslist.com website: www.dodgerslist.com/index/searchBOX.jpgPlease try not to become discouraged. Nerves really do take a long time to heal - think more in terms of months rather than days. My Jeremy also lost deep pain sensation and given a 50-50 chance of walking again. It took weeks before I saw the slightest bit of movement in his hind feet and three months after surgery, I was told he would never walk again. However, three months later he was walking and his walking continued to improve for a year following surgery. So hang in there and try to stay positive. Keep a happy voice and face around Dexter as dogs can be very good at picking up on our feelings. Tell him every day that he's getting better and you believe it, too! Meanwhile, enjoy each day with Dexter and know that you're doing all that you can to help him heal. Healing prayers for Dexter and please continue to keep us updated.
|
|
|
Post by Kristin & Dexter on Dec 4, 2019 10:25:53 GMT -7
Hello Marjorie,
Thank you for all of the information! Dexter is not currently showing any signs of pain. He's fairly calm most of the time, with some bursts of energy and wanting to play.
For the last 5 days Dexter was taking 1 prednisone dose every 12 hours (9am and 9pm). Yesterday, 12/4, he moved to 1 every 24 hours (9pm) for the next 5 days. He will then move to 1 every other day until they are gone. He is also taking 10mg of omeprazole every 12 hours for his tummy.
With regard to expressing the bladder, we were given a demonstration at the vet before discharge, however they had provided us with instruction express every 8 hours. We quickly learned that 8 hours is definitely too long and have been adjusting to find the best schedule to keep from bladder overflow. At this point, I think we're ALMOST there. We both work during the day, but my husband and his mom work close to our home so they have worked out a timeline for one of them to come home about halfway through the day for bladder expression. Yesterday he was expressed at 6:00am when we left for work (he made it through the night dry) but when my husband's mom arrived at 2:00pm he had wet the pad quite a bit. He then made it through last night dry.
We are definitely looking into hydrotherapy for after his staples removed (we will be taking him in December 11th for removal). We placed Dexter's pen in our living room at the end of the couch and are sure to give him pats on the head and tell him he's a good boy every time we walk past. I also try to get down on the floor and give him snuggles without removing him from his bed/pen at least every evening when I get home from work.
|
|
|
Post by Julie & Perry on Dec 4, 2019 17:49:22 GMT -7
Prednisone makes dogs very thirsty so they pee a lot.
He may need to go as often as every 2-3 hours while on the Prednisone.
|
|
|
Post by Kristin & Dexter on Dec 4, 2019 21:43:13 GMT -7
We had a little bit of a scare today. All of the medication that Dexter is on has made him constipated. He has been making small bowel movements, about the size of a matchbox car, an average of once per day. Those small bowel movements were very hard and dry.
Last night he ate dinner, slowly which is abnormal for him, and then proceeded to throw it up. We still had to give him more medicine, so we gave him a little more food, which he ate, and that seemed to stay down. He ate his breakfast this morning and when my husband came home from work to check on him he had thrown up again. He was also acting lethargic and sad, which is not how he’s been the last few days.
So we took him to the vet to have him checked. The good news is that everything is looking great. His incision is healing well, no fever, no eye ear or mouth issues. I also requested a urinalysis just to be sure he doesn’t have a UTI, as his urine is fairly pungent.They helped us manually express him and gave us some ✙anti-nausea medication as well as a ✙stool softener to help him out moving forward.
[Moderator's note: please do not edit 30 lbs. Prednisone as of 11/27: 5mg 2x/day for 5 days before tapering Gabapentin 100 mg 3x/day omeprazole 10gmgs 2x/day ✙ name of anti- nausea? ✙ name of stool softner]
Now that we got things moving we’ll wait a bit to see if he keeps going on his own, we did give him some more pumpkin tonight, though.
Hoping for the best moving forward!
|
|
Marjorie
Moderator~
Member since 2011. Surgery & Conservative
Posts: 5,724
|
Post by Marjorie on Dec 5, 2019 6:09:18 GMT -7
Sorry to hear of these issues that Dexter has been experiencing, Kristin. Prednisone is known for causing GI distress. Omeprazole can take 3-5 days to reach peak effectiveness but then it should be a good acid suppressor. However, sometimes a stomach protector is not enough to protect against the side effects of Prednisone. An anti-nausea med may help with nausea but it won't heal any damage to the GI tract that Prednisone may have caused. Please speak to the vet this morning about adding Sucralfate. Sucralfate works in a different way to bandaid the damaged mucus lining and also promotes a healing environment. Sucralfate will require timing with other meds…so do your homework so you can discuss things with the vet: www.marvistavet.com/sucralfate.pmlGood to see you have pumpkin on board. Pumpkin can help with constipation that can result from surgery. Should Dexter develop diarrhea due to the GI distress from the Prednisone, pumpkin can also help with that. Give one teaspoon of pumpkin for every 10 pounds of body weight per day. To loosen the stool, add equal parts water to each kibble meal along with plain canned pureed pumpkin 1x a day. To firm up the stool, add pumpkin to kibble and no extra water 1x a day. Note alternatives for constipation: really ripe mashed fresh pear, just take off the peel; microwaved and mashed peeled sweet potato.
Not sure, but it sounds as though you may be giving the pills in Dexter's food. If so, please know that it's best not to give meds with food because if they vomit or if they don't finish the food, then they don't get all the meds and you don't know how much they did get. Pill pockets work well or hide the pills in a small piece of meat or peanut butter or something else that Dexter really loves. If he rejects that, this trick sometimes helps. The pills can be placed into the well of a small mashed banana ball, a cream cheese ball, liverwurst ball or inside of a sticky marshmallow and sealed so no taste is on the exterior. Use the three treat method. 2 treats with no meds inside PLUS the med ball. Give plain treat while holding med ball in front of eyes. The idea is your dog will be greedy after the first treat to get the 2nd. Immediately hold the 3rd plain treat so he will hurry to swallow the med ball to get to treat #3. Glad to hear that everything else is looking great and hope that Dexter is feeling much better today.
|
|
|
Post by Kristin & Dexter on Dec 5, 2019 13:08:47 GMT -7
Thank you everyone for your responses.
We aren't necessarily feeding him at the same time that he eats. He gets omeprazole at 6 and then prednisone at 9, dinner is at 7:30, so we aren't feeding him WITH his food, but we wanted to be sure he wasn't taking medication on a totally empty stomach when 9 o'clock pills rolled around.
He was able to poop again on his own last night after going to the vet, so hopefully that's a sign of easy movements moving forward. The vet called this morning after receiving the urinalysis results and confirmed that he does have a UTI. They called in a prescription for ✙amoxicillin and he will start that today. I don't have any details about dosage yet, but will when I return home from work today.
[Moderator's note: please do not edit 30 lbs. Prednisone as of 11/27: 5mg 2x/day for 5 days before tapering Gabapentin 100 mg 3x/day omeprazole 10gmgs 2x/day ✙ name of anti- nausea? ✙ name of stool softner ✙ amoxicillin ]
I did want to ask about feeling returning in his hind legs. Off and on the last two nights it seems like he can sometimes feel when we're doing things like lightly touching the shaved are of his back, moving his hind legs for his passive ROM exercises, and squeezing the webbing between his pads. Every once in a while we're doing his ROM I'll push a little urine out and he looks down at it like he's surprised. This hasn't been happening as much lately, as we have gotten better at expressing, but it was happening before we were able to completely empty the bladder. It's not consistent and seems like one night he'll do it and then the following morning he doesn't. Am I imagining his responses and seeing what I want to see, or is it possible that feeling is just slowly coming back inconsistently?
|
|
|
Post by Julie & Perry on Dec 5, 2019 13:58:21 GMT -7
Nerves heal very slowly and it seems perfectly reasonable that they could heal in such a way as to sometimes let a nerve impulse through but not yet 100 percent.
Dexter definitely sounds as if he's doing very well!
Keep up the good work 😀
|
|
|
Post by Kristin & Dexter on Dec 5, 2019 14:13:45 GMT -7
Oh good! I was hoping that would be the case, but have also been trying not to get my hopes up.
I did have one other question. Dexter's penis comes out of the sheath when we express his bladder. When I noticed that was happening I started keeping an eye on it to be sure it retracted. It does, it's just slow to do it which I assume is due to the paralysis. The color is still normal and it is coming out and retracting consistently. However, in the last day or two I have noticed that it retracts faster. It used to be that we would express him and then I would do his exercises and by the time I was done with those (about 25 minutes start to finish) it was almost completely retracted. Now, it appears to be retracting before I am done with his exercises. - First question, is his penis coming out normal, or should I be concerned about this? -Second question, is the fact that it's retracting a bit quicker a sign that some feeling may be coming back in his hind quarters?
Thank you!
|
|
|
Post by Romy & Frankie on Dec 5, 2019 14:21:36 GMT -7
Julie is correct when she says that nerve healing is not totally linear so it is possible for Dexter to have days when he seems more responsive to touch than on other days.
Are you seeing any signs of a happy tail wag? That is the first stage of healing that can be easily identified by the pet parent.
It is good that you are not giving the pred on a totally empty stomach because having food present can offer extra protection from harmful stomach acid.
The UTI was probably making him uncomfortable so now that he is being treated he should quickly feel better.
|
|
|
Post by Romy & Frankie on Dec 5, 2019 14:26:03 GMT -7
The penis not retracting sometimes happens in IVDD dog. That happened to my dog Frankie after his surgery. As his condition improved it started happening less and less.
I am not sure if it retracting more quickly is a sign of improvement but it is not something to be worried about.
|
|
|
Post by Kristin & Dexter on Dec 5, 2019 21:59:29 GMT -7
Dexter was able to make it from 5:30am to 2pm without wetting his crate! He then made it to 8 when he started whining. I went over and expressed his bladder and now he’s laying back down and sleeping. I’m wondering if him whining to let me know he needed to go is a sign that he has control over his bladder. My husband thinks it means that he can’t do it on his own, but I’m not sure.
To add to my post above, he’s on 2.5ml liquid ✙amoxicillin every 12 hours for the next 10 days. We will then take him in for a follow up urinalysis to make sure the UTI is gone. He had his first dose at 6pm tonight so that we were able to line his 12 hour dosages up with our departure for work.
[Moderator's note: please do not edit 30 lbs. Prednisone as of 11/27: 5mg 2x/day for 5 days before tapering Gabapentin 100 mg 3x/day omeprazole 10gmgs 2x/day ✙Amoxicillin 200mg per 5mL: 100 mgs (2.5 mL dose) 2x/day]
He is much more lively tonight than he has been the last few nights, so I think the expression of his poop helped. He was even able to poop a little bit on his own again tonight.
Post by Kristin & Dexter on 12/6 18 hours prior Hello Romy,
Unfortunately, it's hard to tell with Dexter because he has a docked tail and quite a bit of butt fluff. Even before this he really only moved his nub when he was excited about playing fetch or really excited about a guest getting to our house. I'll be sure to try to monitor his nub though. He does get excited when I get home from work and usually a little bit playful so he may do it in that situation.
|
|
|
Post by Julie & Perry on Dec 6, 2019 0:05:49 GMT -7
Being able to go longer without needing to be expressed could be that you're improving at getting the urine out and/or that his bladder control is getting better.
Whining when he needs to go out is a good sign that Dexter's bladder is telling him when it's full.
Are you giving him the chance to sniff and pee?
When he can do that you'll know his bladder control is definitely returning.
|
|
Marjorie
Moderator~
Member since 2011. Surgery & Conservative
Posts: 5,724
|
Post by Marjorie on Dec 6, 2019 5:44:00 GMT -7
Julie is absolutely right - it's time for a sniff and pee test! Whining to alert you that he needs to go out may well mean that he can now feel that his bladder is full and that he needs to go out but the only way to be sure is to do a sniff and pee test. Carry Dexter to a spot outside where he or another dog has peed, support his hind end but not under his belly, let him sniff and see if he can release urine on his own. If he can, then he has some bladder control. You should then express him to make sure his bladder is empty such time as you're sure that he's able to completely empty the bladder on his own.
Does the Amoxicillin bottle say how many mgs are in one ml?
Please let us know how the sniff and pee test goes.
|
|
|
Post by Kristin & Dexter on Dec 6, 2019 9:07:11 GMT -7
Hello Marjorie,
I checked and it is 200mg per 5ml, it's early here but if my math is right he is taking 100mg two times per day.
As far as a sniff and pee test, the sling that we were provided does not have an open area for him to expel through. He gets his staples out on Wednesday and we are planning to ask the vet about other slings at that time so that we can start letting him attempt to go outside. Every time we do his sling walks he goes right to the door, so he definitely misses being out there.
This morning when I was performing his ROM exercises I noticed some muscle twitches in his hind legs and when my husband was expressing his bladder he felt some muscle flutters, which I believe could be a good sign that things are starting to heal.
|
|
PaulaM
Moderator.
Member since 2007: surgery, conservative . Montana, USA
Posts: 19,541
|
Post by PaulaM on Dec 6, 2019 9:14:46 GMT -7
Kristin, you can put together rather easily a figure 8 sling. A sling is used as back up to catch a wobbly dog's butt and prevent twisting the back. Any sling needs to be accompanied by a front harness and leash to control speed to the very slow minimal footsteps at potty time especially during conservative treatment or the post-op crate rest period. A figure 8 DIY sling works especially well for the male dog anatomy at potty times.
|
|
|
Post by Kristin & Dexter on Dec 12, 2019 0:25:39 GMT -7
Dexter had an appointment tonight to remove his staples and the [DVM] vet was able to confirm returning DPS in both legs! She did the punch test on each and he pulled both legs back
Even though I know he still has a long way to go, this small progression has given me so much encouragement. Yesterday was a really rough day, I spent most of t crying, so this was just what I needed.
|
|
Marjorie
Moderator~
Member since 2011. Surgery & Conservative
Posts: 5,724
|
Post by Marjorie on Dec 12, 2019 5:43:23 GMT -7
So glad to hear of the signs of DPS in both legs, Kristin. You mentioned that it's difficult to determine a happy tail wag with Dexter. Have you been successful in getting a sling that works better for him and has a sniff and pee test been done yet? Hopefully that will be the next sign of nerve healing that you'll see.
There is no time limit for nerves to heal...it can take weeks, months or even a year or longer. However, it is known that neurological function usually returns in the reverse order of the damage. 1. Deep Pain Sensation (Only correctly identified by a specialist.) 2. Tail wagging with joy at seeing you, getting a treat or due to your happy talk. 3. Bladder and bowel control proved by passing the "sniff and pee" test. Take your dog out to an old pee spot in the grass. Let him sniff and then observe for release of urine. 4. Leg movement, and then ability to move up into a standing position, and then wobbly walking. 5. Being able to walk with more steadiness and properly placed paws. 6. Ability to walk unassisted and perhaps even run.
It's very early days in Dexter's healing so hang in there. Stay strong, stay positive and never give up hope!
|
|
|
Post by Julie & Perry on Dec 12, 2019 7:28:59 GMT -7
Kristin, Dexter's deep pain sensation returning is a really good sign!
It means that his nerves are beginning to heal.
Think of this as a marathon and pace yourself. It's going to take time and work.
Try to stay positive and happy around Dexter. He looks to you as his pack leader.
|
|
|
Post by Kristin & Dexter on Dec 12, 2019 7:47:59 GMT -7
Marjorie,
I talked to the vet last night and the answered a bunch of questions for me, including instructing me on how to let him try to pee outside. We’ll be trying that today once it’s light out and starting 5 minute walks out in the yard each day.
We have a neurology follow up on Wednesday where we will get more instruction for PT to do at home and I’ve already located a local animal hospital with a wonderful rehabilitation program that we’ll be getting him into as soon as we are cleared by his neurologist.
|
|
|
Post by Kristin & Dexter on Dec 21, 2019 15:16:50 GMT -7
Dexter had his neurology follow up on Wednesday, December 18th. Unfortunately we were told at that appointment that the movement we THOUGHT had been DPS returning was actually reflexes. They’re reflexes that he didn’t have until about a week ago, but reflexes nonetheless. His neuro has downgraded his prognosis to an20% chance of regaining mobility. For the most part he’s been happy, he was cleared to scoot, under strict supervision, for about 5 minutes each day. He’s really been enjoying that.
Fast forward to this morning (December 21st) he appears to have developed neuropathy. We woke up this morning and found his potty pad and sheet covering his bed with a large area of blood and a bloody back foot. Once we got it cleaned up we found that he had chewed 3 nails down to the quick at some point while we were sleeping. We took him to his primary vet and they cleaned him up more and applied something to ensure the bleeding wouldn’t start again. He’s back on ✙gabapentin now, two 100mg capsules every 8 hours and we’ve been instructed to keep an eye on him and cover his feet with booties or by wrapping them if he continues. We’re also having issues with his penis not staying in. We’re lubeing it and placing it back in each time he’s expressed and keeping an eye on it to ensure it doesn’t dry out.
I feel like we’ve just encountered one thing after another and my husband and I are really starting to question whether we can actually keep giving Dexter the care that he needs to live a good life. It’s a heartbreaking thought, but something we’re seriously going to have to consider I think.
|
|
|
Post by Romy & Frankie on Dec 21, 2019 15:58:23 GMT -7
It must have been very discouraging to hear that DPS has not returned to Dexter and to hear the neuro 's prediction of 20% chance of regaining mobility. Surgeons are often quite pessimistic regarding a dog's chance of recovery. I think what happens is that surgeons do not typically do long term follow-up of our dogs and therefore are not aware that a number of dogs continue to improve as the months go by. The last time my dog Frankie saw his excellent surgeon was at the one-month follow-up appointment. At this time, Frankie was still paralyzed and incontinent. There had been no improvement to his neuro function at all during that month. I do not think the surgeon ever knew that Frankie regained his ability to walk and bladder and bowel control.
Neuropathy can be very dangerous. Until you are sure that the gabapentin is controlling it you may want to use an e-collar on Dexter during times when you can not keep an eye on him. You can even make your own. Directions are here: forum.greytalk.com/index.php/topic/220138-create-your-own-surgical-collar/
I had the same problem with Frankie's penis not retracting after his surgery. I also was told to lubricate it. This was truly one of the weirdest things I have even done. As Frankie healed his penis began to retract normally.
Rehab can be very helpful after surgery. Frankie did water therapy where he walked on an underwater treadmill. I do not think he would have recovered nearly as quickly without it. When he started this he could not stand alone. The water in the tank supported him. The therapist moved his back legs in a walking movement. As time went by, Frankie was able to stand alone. First for a few seconds than longer and longer. The level of water in the tank was lowered along with Frankie's ability to support himself. The therapist did not need to move his legs, only reposition his feet from time to time. When I first brought Frankie to the rehab center I sling walked him. His back legs were a dead weight. By the time we had finished a few months of therapy, he was walking. This is how the underwater treadmill works: I know how hard it can seem to take care of a paralyzed dog. It gets easier as time goes by. You will be able to give Dexter a good quality of life. It too soon to know if he will regain his ability to walk. It can take months and in a few cases years for dogs to regain this ability. If Dexter does not regain it, he will enjoy scooting around the house. He can use a cart when he is outside. This will become the new normal for you both. There is no need to consider anything else. When I think of quality of life for a paralyzed dog I like to think of this video.
|
|
|
Post by Kristin & Dexter on Dec 21, 2019 17:12:16 GMT -7
Thank you for the kind response Romy. I go through waves of thinking we can handle it and then worrying that we can’t. It gets especially bad when more things seem to be going wrong rather than showing positive progress.
I have an appointment for him in January 2nd for a full evaluation with a veterinary physical therapist so that they can determine the best program for him to try to get him walking again. They have cold laser therapy as a part of their program and then I think I’m also going to find a separate place for water therapy. His neuro suggested only doing swim therapy and said that underwater treadmill may not benefit him since he’s not using his hind legs. However it sounds like maybe we should try the treadmill anyway?
Getting his penis lubed and placed back inside is most definitely one of the weirdest things I’ve ever had to do. My husband was really weirded out about if for the first couple of days but he’s come around and realized it’s a necessary thing to keep him healthy.
|
|
|
Post by Ann Brittain on Dec 22, 2019 7:12:48 GMT -7
A dog's recovery can be a roller coaster ride of good days and bad days. I remember how stressful those times were after Buster had his surgery. Like Dexter, he was not able to walk when he came home from the hospital. We did not have a facility to give him swim therapy with a treadmill, but when we got the vet's okay, I improvised and did bathtub therapy. Over time, he got stronger and was eventually able to walk. It was never 100 percent normal but he regained bladder control and didn't seem to be bothered by his disability.
We also did the cold laser therapy and acupuncture with Buster. It's hard to say which therapy was the most effective, but when I was giving him 'swim' therapy, I noticed him gaining strength day by day.
The key is to be consistent once the therapist gives his/her recommendations.
|
|
Marjorie
Moderator~
Member since 2011. Surgery & Conservative
Posts: 5,724
|
Post by Marjorie on Dec 22, 2019 9:24:57 GMT -7
Each dog responds differently to types of therapy. Many members have had much success with underwater treadmill therapy. The therapist can get in the tank with Dexter and move his hind legs in a walking motion. The water's buoyancy will help hold his hips up. There are also water exercises as Ann mentioned that you can do at home once the stitches are out and of course only with the approval of the surgeon. Here's more info on those exercises: www.dodgerslist.com/literature/watertherapy.htmHow is Dexter's neuropathy doing? Has the Gabapentin brought that under control? Until it does, do use an e-collar or rolled up towel around his neck to prevent him from chewing on his feet as Romy recommended. Since Dexter can't feel his feet and the neuropathy is causing pins and needles sensations in his feet, if that feeling gets too severe, he might mutilate his feet even more to try to stop the burning pain. We have learned from past members that socks and wrapping of the feet just don't work as they can be pulled off or chewed through. Dexter is on the correct med - Gabapentin - that deals with this type of pain so hopefully it has helped. More info here: www.dodgerslist.com/literature/neuropathy.pdfI well remember how stressful those early days following surgery were but do know that it will get easier, you will get into a better routine and of course there may well be more healing ahead. It can take months, even a year or more, for healing. Stay strong, stay positive and never give up hope!
|
|
|
Post by Kristin & Dexter on Dec 22, 2019 14:27:24 GMT -7
Marjorie,
His neuropathy seems to be for the most part under control now that we’ve started him back on the ✙gabapentin. We put booties on him last night, which he left alone through the night. When we took the booties off to express his bladder earlier he licked the same foot but we stopped him and another time this afternoon the bootie either came off or he got it off and we caught him licking that same foot again.
We have him in an inflatable doughnut collar now and are getting an e-collar today to have in case the doughnut doesn’t work (we don’t want to be stuck without one if he starts again over the holiday). He doesn’t seem to be in pain, he’s actually been easier to express on the gabapentin and I walked him around the yard today, which he was really excited about. After tomorrow I’m off of work through January 1st so it will be easy to keep an eye on him to monitor how it’s going.
I’ll be calling his neurologist on Monday when he returns to the office just to let him know what happened over the weekend and confirm the dosage he wants for gabapentin. Right now I’m just following the instructions I received post-op which has been keeping him calm.
|
|
|
Post by Judy & Vesper on Dec 22, 2019 23:28:48 GMT -7
Hi there Kristin, at this stage you are handling his situation correctly. What I have found with my own dogs, is that it is usually the foot they drag under them, when they scoot, that develops the problem. I have to bandage my 2 dogs feet every two days, with them the booties didn't work, so everyone has to find the best solution for themselves. Hydrotherapy works very well as it strengthens the core muscles and helps with muscle memory. Even if they use a cart its very important not to let the muscles atrophy.
Just some encouragement, carts work well and a dog can have a great life using one. So not getting DPS back is not the end of having a great doggie life. Mobility can still be attained. It gets easier with time and when you get into a routine. Vesper and Beauty both use their carts like chariots, they outrun the other dogs.
I hope you find this helpful
|
|
|
Post by Kristin & Dexter on Dec 23, 2019 0:44:03 GMT -7
Thank you so much Judy, I feel like sometimes I don’t know if we’re doing the right thing. It’s all so new, and confirmation from someone that is more experienced in this makes me feel better about our decisions. I have some days off coming up for the holidays and I plan to use those to find and start hydrotherapy with him. He’s never really liked water, but I think we can probably persuade him with some peanut butter or something, as he’s very food motivated.
It seems like every time we start to get a routine and feel like maybe we CAN handle this long term something else happens and we go back to worrying about whether he’s getting the best care with us. This site has been so incredibly encouraging though. Hearing from people that have been managing long-term while also being able to continue their lives does make me feel like maybe we CAN do this. We just need to give him and ourselves more time to adjust and learn how to handle this new way of life. He’s a very happy boy and I think he’ll really enjoy the cart once he’s cleared to use one. It just breaks my heart right now watching him on crate rest because he just wants to play so bad.
|
|
|
Post by Judy & Vesper on Dec 23, 2019 1:20:28 GMT -7
Kristin, I understand completely. When I adopted Vesper she was already paralized and I struggled really badly in the beginning until I found Dodgerslist. It is all about finding what works best for you and Dexter. Once you have figured that out it gets easier.
I have seen so many dogs literally get their smile back, when you put them on wheels. It opens their worlds, they hunt, play and run. They also lie down on their front paws to lounge.
Vesper has been running in her cart for almost 5 years, and Beauty who was born disabled, has been running for a year. Shes only 18 months old.
So please remember you are doing very well, and doing the very best you can for him. He knows that.
|
|
|
Post by Michelle & Keira on Dec 23, 2019 5:08:33 GMT -7
Hi Kristin,
Are you on Instagram? If so look up "albertonwheels". Albert is a rescue dog that was very young and fully paralysed in the rear when a family adopted him. They constantly post pics and videos of Albert and all the things he gets up to. They take him daily on beach walls and big hikes etc. Please watch some of his videos, it should give you plenty of inspiration to see how happy a dog can still be regardless of whether their legs work.
I like your pic of Dexter, he looks like a happy and energetic dog.
All the best, Michelle
|
|