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Post by Jean & Mimi on Oct 24, 2013 5:34:52 GMT -7
Thanks for the idea on the toe grips! Those look amazing
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StevieLuv
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Post by StevieLuv on Oct 24, 2013 10:21:34 GMT -7
We have had great success with toe grips - they can even be glued on if needed. There is a facebook page for Dr. Buzby's Toe Grips that has alot of "how to" videos. I like them because unlike booties or grippy socks they don't cause issues with twisting around or cause sweaty feet. Some members have had great success with some bootie styles, but for Stevie they caused more problems than benefits.
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Post by Jean & Mimi on Oct 24, 2013 10:29:25 GMT -7
So here's a dumb question but I figure better to ask then to be sorry. I am now trying to stay really positive and look at life after 8 weeks.
I have read the materials and I am already investigating a ramp for the house (we may build some for our very minimal short steps to the backyard)and will take the time to train her to use the ramp for the couch (bedroom doors can be kept shut - our house is mainly 1 level). We will keep her crated during the day when we aren't home. Our downstairs luckily has a door that we keep shut so no risk of her going downstairs unless we can carry her.
Will I ever be able to have her snuggle next to me? To pick her up and cuddle her? I have resigned myself that she will never sleep with us again (I cannot tell you how sad this makes me) but I would love to be able to have her in bed next to me or on the couch or even best of all on my lap. Or will I always just have to have her on a completely flat surface (like the floor). Again, I will do what I have to do for her but I am hoping I get get back some of what we had before. I was "hers" before this whole thing happened and while she is excited to see me when I get home, I don't get the kisses anymore.
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StevieLuv
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Post by StevieLuv on Oct 24, 2013 10:45:52 GMT -7
Of course you will be able to hold and cuddle again (and be covered in doggie kisses too). The first time I was able to cuddle Stevie after her crate rest, I spent the entire time soaking her fur with tears of gratitude ( I'm getting teary just remembering). The biggest danger is in the sudden bolt off of the furniture without using the ramp. The use of furniture blockers and ramp training will help with this. Stevie now has a bed on the floor right next to our bed, I can reach down and touch her easily and she accepted that really quickly, as that is where her crate went at night when she was on crate rest. Keep the Faith - it will all be alright (((hugs)))
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Post by Pam & Dobby on Oct 24, 2013 10:50:23 GMT -7
Jean, thanks for asking! How is Mimi? Here are some bootie and related products recommended by members of another dog group that I participate in: www.puppylovepawpads.com/products.asp Comment: I got the full size circles, but I would get the cut out pads next time. ... has issues with the floors and the pads worked great. Unfortunately since she still goes out on walks I would waste them so I ended up attaching them to her old soft quilted booties. As long as I have them on tight they don't slip around. www.muttluks.com/product_home.php?cat=2 www.amazon.com/Show-Foot-Professional-Anti-Slip-Spray/dp/B000NEL3EK Note: I have not tried any of these myself. Like you, I'm just looking at various things we might need after 8 weeks.
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lupi
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Doing better every day!
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Post by lupi on Oct 24, 2013 14:17:41 GMT -7
Hi Jean, I hope Mimi is having a good day today. I too am so anxious for the day I'll be able to cuddle my baby girl at night (she never slept with us but always had morning and evening cuddles in our bed) I don't know if you already have one, but I wanted to suggest a dog stroller. I just bought one for Lupi today and I really wish I had weeks ago. She absolutely loves it. I wheel her from room to room with me, placing her in the sunlight (they love their sun patches, don't they?) and she is so content. I took her out for a stroll around the block and she got to watch the birds and squirrels and got a treat from the mail-lady. Right now, I'm sitting on the couch and she is level with me, easily within petting range. It might be easier on both of you to have some normalcy of routine back. For Lupi, daily walks were a highlight of her day. Well, I hope you're both having a good day-hang in there! Nicole
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Post by Jean & Mimi on Oct 25, 2013 6:48:56 GMT -7
So Now that Mimi is feeling so much better and is back to her "normal" self, she is getting bored. She was always a big chewer and would sit for a good while with something to chew in her paws. She never felt the need to "kill" what she was chewing. What can I give her? Bully sticks? I never give rawhide and did give her a hoof but she cracked it up to much and I don't want to go there. Any thoughts you have would be great. Also, today I noticed when I looked at her from above that her hips were much narrower than they had been before. I assume this is from loss of muscle tone but I just wanted to check with you guys. Hoping for a pain-free, nerve regenerating weekend for everyone on Dodgerslist going through this process
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PaulaM
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Post by PaulaM on Oct 25, 2013 11:56:45 GMT -7
Jean, most dogs need some 16-18 hours of sleep per day, people sleep 8-9 hours day. What are they doing in the crate? Laying around and sleeping! Don't give into the temptation to start a treat routine to combat non-existent boredom. Adding a bunch of treats as entertainment contributes to weight gain which isn't a good thing; Bullie Sticks are pretty high calorie and have additional problems: speakingforspot.com/blog/2013/03/24/the-lowdown-on-bully-sticks/ What you CAN do is soak the kibble in broth and freeze each of her normal kibble portion into a Kong so Mimi has a job... working for her dinners. Just a frozen broth cube is low calorie and can take some time to lick it gone. Loss of muscle tone you see will come back soon after 8 weeks of rest when it is safe for the disc and the spinal cord to resume physical activity.
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Post by Jean & Mimi on Oct 25, 2013 12:01:45 GMT -7
I have to try the kibble/broth/Kong combo. She is so funny now...she looks at us and scratches at the crate because she wants affection all the time (but will still not give me a kiss the little bugger). Last night she would not rest until I sat down on the floor right next to her crate.
I just hope she continues to feel as good next week when we start her very slow taper.
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Post by Pam & Dobby on Oct 28, 2013 9:02:10 GMT -7
Hope Mimi is doing well today and has no pain as the taper starts. Hoping slow will = smooth this time around.
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Post by Jean & Mimi on Oct 28, 2013 9:25:28 GMT -7
Very quick update...I got kisses this weekend yay! Stuck my face next to her crate and kiss kiss kiss kiss kiss through the crate Tomorrow I call the vet and we will start the taper later this week. Good thing we have a leash/harness. Yesterday hubs took her out for potty break and she saw me through the glass door. He said she wandered like she was going to jump up on the patio! Of course she is not allowed and he had her on her leash but man, I guess she is feeling better. I am concerned about how to train her on the ramps outside when this is over. We will be investing in a soft foam ramp for inside and will have two ramps for outside. The first ramp for outside will be from our back door down to the patio (it will cover a total of two steps). Our patio is only about 3 or 4 inches above the backyard and has no railing around it (nor any way to put one up that isn't ridiculously expensive). I can create a wide ramp from the patio to the yard but I am afraid she won't use it. How can I train her to make sure she does? I am not as concerned about the one from our back door on to the patio because the one I have found to purchase is about as wide as that space so she will have to use it.
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PaulaM
Moderator.
Member since 2007: surgery, conservative . Montana, USA
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Post by PaulaM on Oct 28, 2013 9:42:57 GMT -7
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Post by Jean & Mimi on Oct 28, 2013 10:24:16 GMT -7
Thank you for this article Paula!!!
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Post by Jean & Mimi on Oct 28, 2013 14:10:38 GMT -7
Grrr so angry. In our veterinary practice, there are 3 drs. 2 are more experienced, one is new - only a year out of school. The more experienced vets have been the ones who have been receptive and helpful to Mimi - listening to our concerns, agreeing to increase her dex and leaving her on for longer term to let her body heal. The younger guy wants her off the dex as soon as possible etc. So we have basically been dealing with the experienced vets.
Today, we needed more sucralfate. The vets office has been typically great about giving us refills when we need them or a prescription right away. Well the new vet was in the office and refused to give hubs the script for sucralfate. He said she doesn't need it, it's for ulcers, not as a preventative and she has no need. One of the two more experienced vets told us to put her on it when we increased the dex dosage. I am so mad!!! I feel like he has no clue what he is talking about.
The other experienced vet who we have been working with (who saw Mimi last Tuesday) wanted me to call her tomorrow anyway to follow up and discuss the slow taper. I will speak with her tomorrow and ask for the prescription. Sorry for venting but I am so angry at this guy who thinks he knows everything after only practicing for one year and quoting "literature" to me. How about experience!!!!
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StevieLuv
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Post by StevieLuv on Oct 28, 2013 15:22:25 GMT -7
That is really frustrating - let your regular Vet know about your difficulties, perhaps they can put a note in your file regarding refills, so you don't have to go through this evey time you have to see the newbie. He has to learn, but sometimes they are so insecure that they can act like idiots, and our pets pay the price. Hope all goes well tomorrow
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Post by Jean & Mimi on Oct 29, 2013 9:33:45 GMT -7
Ok, so today we start taper (10/29). We are giving 1/4 less tab of dex every day for two weeks, then assuming that goes well, we will taper another 1/4 for two weeks etc. We will taper her Tramadol as well, but not right away because we want to give her (apparently) very sensitive body time to adjust to each taper. She also gave the script to continue sucralfate. So for today through Sunday her dosing will be as follows: Dexamethosone: .25 mg am, .125mg pm (afternoon .125 removed) Tramadol: 25 mg 3x per day (morning, afternoon, evening - every 8 hrs) Gabapentin: 40mg 2x per day Pepcid: 5mg 2x per day Sucralfate: (cannot remember dosage) 2x per day Assuming everything is ok, beginning on Monday (11/4), we will also remove the afternoon dose of Tramadol for the remainder of the two week period. So that dosing will look like this: Dexamethosone: .25 mg am, .125mg pm (afternoon .125 removed) Tramadol: 25 mg 2x per day (morning and evening) Gabapentin: 40mg 2x per day Pepcid: 5mg 2x per day Sucralfate: (cannot remember dosage) 2x per day I have been telling Mimi for the past few days that this taper is going to go just fine, that her body will be able to take over the job of the steroid and that she is going to be ok. At this time, she has been on the increased level of Dex for 18 days, and I think her body has finally kicked in to get the swelling totally down. Power of positive thinking right? She just kind of looks at me quizically - basically wanting to know if the pep talk comes with cheese
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StevieLuv
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Conservative Treatment 3x. It really does work!
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Post by StevieLuv on Oct 29, 2013 9:44:04 GMT -7
Everything is better with cheese
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Post by Pam & Dobby on Nov 1, 2013 8:35:04 GMT -7
How is Mimi doing with the first step of the taper?
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Post by Jean & Mimi on Nov 1, 2013 9:42:56 GMT -7
Thanks for asking, but I don't really want to talk about it. For fear of jinxing anything
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Post by Pam & Dobby on Nov 1, 2013 12:08:02 GMT -7
No jinxing allowed Just know that we are pulling for you!
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Post by Jean & Mimi on Nov 2, 2013 4:26:55 GMT -7
Moderators if you are aound I have a quick question. Was giving Mimi her morning pepcid (1/2 hour after her sucralfate) when I spotted the sucralfate lying in her crate! Little sneaky dog...thought she swallowed it earlier (even licked her nose like she did). She had just swallowed the pepcid so there wasn't much I could do. I waited 45 minutes after the pepcid and then gave her the sucralfate again. Is she going to be ok? Her stomach has been just fine the whole time during this process..even when just on pepcid.
I have to leave to go out this afternoon so I won't be home to watch her. Please reassure me that this one screwup isn't going to cause major GI issuea.
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Post by Pam & Dobby on Nov 2, 2013 6:54:37 GMT -7
Was the sucralfate still given before the Dex? If so, I think she should be OK.
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Post by Jean & Mimi on Nov 2, 2013 7:11:17 GMT -7
Yes an hour before the dex.
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Sabrina
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My Charley-dog, a Dodger'sList grad enjoying life!
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Post by Sabrina on Nov 2, 2013 8:59:00 GMT -7
Hi Jean! My Charley was a sneaky one about pills, too! Do try not to worry (it's so hard, I know!!!) You've been doing a great job protecting Mimi's stomach. I'm still learning about IVDD meds myself, but it sounds to me like you did the right thing after finding the "surprise pill"(!) in Mimi's crate. (Well done for being so observant, by the way!)
))Hugs!(( to you! - Sabrina
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StevieLuv
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Post by StevieLuv on Nov 2, 2013 9:12:12 GMT -7
She will be fine - like Sabrina said, her tummy is well protected so one dropped dose shouldn't be an issue. Sneaky little devil - now you will really have to watch her
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Post by Jean & Mimi on Nov 4, 2013 7:12:41 GMT -7
Good morning everyone, hope all your dogs are pain free.
As I begin to look toward the future, I have a couple of questions.
1 - Mimi will still be tapering when the 8 weeks of crate rest are finally up. Do I need to continue crate rest through the rest of the taper? Or do I just monitor her closely and watch for signs of pain? (easing her very slowly back into activity)
2 - I have a harness that I'm not thrilled with right now. I looked at the two links posted on Dodgerslist for harnesses. Does anyone have a preference on which they like better?
3 - She is still wobbly on her back end, but not nearly as much as she was...now more just like a drunken stagger sometimes. We are still slinging her during potty times. Once crate rest is over, do I continue to sling her forever? Or after she has built up some muscle tone can we stop slinging her and let her go on her own? Please note that the slinging right now is really just as a backup support during potty breaks so she doesn't fall over. She really doesn't need it and I haven't seen her really list to the side in a few weeks. We will be getting her Toe Grips to help her maintain her balance on slippery surfaces.
4 - Those first few days after crate rest. I know we have to gently ease her back into activity. But at that point, can I pick her up and have her on the couch with me or on the bed? She wants desperately to sit with us or next to us or anywhere near us.
5 - Regarding the sucralfate, is there a point where I can drop this? Say a few days after the next taper starts? She was put on the sucralfate when we increased her dex. If the next taper (next week) goes ok, she will be down to half the dosage she was at her high point. Could I then remove the sucralfate and then just give the pepcid? When she was initally diagnosed she took pepcid alone for 2 weeks and had no GI issues and her dosing was higher than it will be during the next taper.
As a point of reference, to keep everyone updated, since Saturday, this is her med list:
Dexamethosone: .25mg in the am, .125 pm Tramadol: 25 mg am and 25 mg pm (afternoon dose is gone) Gabapentin: 40 mg am and pm Sucralfate: (so bad - don't know the dosage): am and pm Pepcid: 5 mg in am and pm
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StevieLuv
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Post by StevieLuv on Nov 4, 2013 8:57:07 GMT -7
Where will Mimi be in 8 weeks with regard to her taper? Once the swelling is gone the taper allows the body to start producing its own cortisone again. In other words she shouldn't be out of her crate if she is still on an anti-inflammatory dose of steriods. She should also be off of all pain meds by the time she is off of crate rest, so that there is no chance of medications masking a still existing problem. We have losts of information here on the after crate rest time, to ease your girl back into activity. After crate rest activity www.dodgerslist.com/literature/AfterCrateRest.htmMake your home back friendly www.dodgerslist.com/literature/protectback.htm
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Post by Jean & Mimi on Nov 4, 2013 9:08:51 GMT -7
Because of how her body reacted to the initial tapers and the length of time she had to be on the anti-inflammatory, we have to go super slow with her taper. By the time 8 weeks is up, she will be in the middle of her 2nd taper (with one more week to go) which will be the following:
November 18th Dexamethosone: .125 am and pm (down from .25 am and .125 pm)(one more week at this dose, then down to just .125 1x per day for two weeks, then down to .125 every other day for two weeks) Tramadol: Not sure on how much she will be getting. As of this past Saturday, she dropped one dose completely with no sign of pain. I know we will taper again but have to discuss the details with my vet. Gabapentin - she may be on this longer...we haven't discussed taper yet.
Based on this...do I need to keep her on crate rest for even longer? I am willing to go another week if I have to but I really don't want to keep her trapped forever. Are those doses still at the high anti-inflammatory level?
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StevieLuv
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Post by StevieLuv on Nov 4, 2013 9:31:14 GMT -7
The long taper that she is one is to ensure that she has no pain, and therefore no swelling still present. Until you are absolutely sure that she is okay, I would definitely recommend continuing crate rest until your Vet tells you that she is completely out of the woods with regard to swelling. I know that is is disappointing to have to keep her in her crate an extra weeks or so, but better to be safe. She shouldn't be on any pain meds by the end of her crate rest - for the same reason, to make sure that medications are not hiding a still existing problem. Hang in there, you can do it!!!
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Post by Jean & Mimi on Nov 4, 2013 9:44:03 GMT -7
So when she goes to the every other day dose...can I uncrate her then? I believe she will be off of all pain meds then and literally just be finishing the taper so that her body is fully adjusted. The every other day isn't really an anti-inflammatory dose.
I will also be speaking with our vet as well about this extra five weeks. While I want to do the absolute best thing for Mimi, she is already becoming harder to manage as she is feeling better. Another five weeks may be a huge challenge.
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