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Post by flipflops on Aug 22, 2013 10:59:35 GMT -7
I am on this forum for my friend's dog, but I have 2 dachshunds of my own too. I noticed she was breathing fast, stomach tucked & tight, yelped when carried on 6/30, we went straight to the vet and diagnosed with either pulled muscle or back problem. Placed on ultram & rimadyl. Told to take it easy by vet. The owner only rested her 1 day, the dog acted normal.
Then 8/12, dog wouldn't eat and was acting funny per owner. Brought to vet, did X-ray (disc disease), morphine injection, rimadyl & ultram. 8/17 ER vet, checked neuros and found they were a little slow. Increased pain med added Valium because dog was too painful to urinate.
--What is your dog's name? Lilly 6 years old, 12 lb
--What breed is your dog and did you specifically get a diagnosis of IVDD? Miniature dachshund. The vet did an X-ray, had someone else look at it. Stated disc disease.
-- What was the date you saw the vet and started 100% STRICT crate rest 24/7? 8/12. The owner still lets her sit outside with harness & leash. Also lets her sit on floor with her ( per ER vet ok). I've told the owner that she is only supposed to take her out of crate to carry to potty. Is what she doing harmful?
-- Is there still currently pain - shivering, trembling, yelping when picked up or moved, reluctant/slow to move head or body, tight hard tummy? Still seems painful when I saw her today, better than this weekend. Tucked tummy.
-- What are the exact names of meds currently given, their doses in mgs and frequencies?
Ultram 25 mg every 8 hours
Valium 2 mg every 8 hours
Rimadyl 25 mg every 24 hours
Venti-disc everyday
-- Currently can your dog wobbly walk? move the legs at all? or wag the tail when you do some happy talk? The dog does a wobbly walk ( only couple steps) falling to side. Each rear leg occasionally drags, but not both at same time. Crossing rear legs. Paw gets stuck under foot often.
-- Do you find wet bedding or leaks on you when lifted up? Soiled poop in crate today. No urine in crate since pain meds increased. Urinated fine outside today.
-- Eating and drinking OK? Yes
-- Poops OK - normal color no dark or bright red blood? Normal
I would say the dog is loosing her footing and dragging legs more since the ER vet visit on Saturday. Still can take a few steps, wag tail. Less pain.the regular vet is doing 2x weekly laser light therapy. We are wondering if a neurologist would be a good option. We arent sure they could help anymore than regular vet. She can be seen on Monday for $128. I don't believe that the owner would be doing surgery. As quoted by ER vet, $5000 - $7000.
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Post by Yvonne & Billy on Aug 22, 2013 13:01:35 GMT -7
What a great friend you are! As a crate-rest graduate mommy, I can tell you that surgery doesn't have to be your first and only option. I'm sure one of the more knowledgeable moderators will answer you shortly but in the meanwhile, read the wealth of information that is on this site. Single most important thing is 100% STRICT crate rest.
Kudos for what an awesome friend you are and a great doxie mommy!
Best,
Yvonne
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Sabrina
Helpful Member 
My Charley-dog, a Dodger'sList grad enjoying life!
Posts: 471 
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Post by Sabrina on Aug 22, 2013 13:23:29 GMT -7
Hi, my name's Sabrina, what's yours? You are such a good friend to seek out help for Lily! Does Lily's mom have internet access? If not, perhaps you could print some info and give it to her? With IVDD, it is so important to understand what is happening in order to help our dogs get the care and rest that they need. Here are some good links to help you and your friend learn about IVDD: Shortcut through IVDD - www.dodgerslist.com/literature/IVDDcourse/index.html^ This is a slide show so keep clicking "next" to view all the slides Overview: Healing during a disc episode - www.dodgerslist.com/literature/healingpage.htmINDEX to Overview: Phases of healing - www.dodgerslist.com/healingindex.htmIf Lily is still showing signs of pain, her mom should call the vet today to get the pain meds adjusted. If Lily is still in pain, this interferes with healing: Pain control- www.dodgerslist.com/literature/healingpain.htmIs Lily on a stomach protector (Pepcid AC)? Many vets aren't proactive about stomach protection, but with the use of anti-inflammatory drugs there are risks of ulcers and other GI problems, so Dodger's List advocates asking the vet if there is any medical reason this specific dog should not be on Pepcid AC: Medications used - www.dodgerslist.com/literature/IVDDcourse/medications_used.htmlInflammation, swelling in the spinal cord - www.dodgerslist.com/literature/healingsweling.htmFor dogs who are treated "conservatively" (that is, they don't have surgery), a full 8wks of 100% Strict Crate Rest is advocated. The reason for the full 8wks is so that enough scar tissue can develop to protect the disc from further damage: Conservative treatment for disc disease (IVDD) - www.dodgerslist.com/literature/conservative.htmCrate Rest Recovery Process - www.dodgerslist.com/literature/CrateRRP.htmClark's helpful supplies for crate rest - www.dodgerslist.com/literature/cratesupplies.htmSo yes, time out of the crate/"recovery suite" is harmful. The crate acts like a "cast" because it is a constant flat surface (under the bed or foam pad), and it prevents our intrepid little doxies from dashing after cats or at the sound of the doorbell! ))Hugs!(( - Sabrina |
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Post by flipflops on Aug 22, 2013 14:38:01 GMT -7
My name is Linda. Both the regular vet and the ER vet said she didn't need Pepcid unless she had tummy upset. I asked specifically for it. I wonder how to get them to give it to her.
Thanks for the additional info on crate rest, I will show or to her. She's so discouraged right now. I gave her all the booklets I had ( i am trying to run a dachshund club) and had her watch the DVD.
I was wondering if a neurologist consult would be able to do more.
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Post by Nancy & Polly on Aug 22, 2013 15:54:26 GMT -7
Ask the vet if there is a specific reason that Lily may NOT take Pepcid. If the answer is no, then give it to her. I don't know why so many vets are hesitant to give it until problems appear. Why not prevent the problems in the first place? It's a mystery to me.
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Post by Pauliana on Aug 22, 2013 20:07:14 GMT -7
Hi Linda, How wonderful of you to help your friend and her dog, Lilly.. A Board certified Neurologist sees many cases of IVDD daily and is usually more experienced with the disease than a general vet. Whether she opts for surgery or not Neurologist can be very helpful with this condition even if the dog is going to get conservative treatment. www.dodgerslist.com/literature/VetchkList.htmwww.dodgerslist.com/neurocorner.htmAs Nancy mentioned ask your vet if there is a medical reason why Lilly can't take Pepcid AC? (Famotidine is the generic name) If there is no medical reason you can pick it up at the grocery store or drug store. We give Doxies 5mg every 12 hours, 30 minutes prior to the Rimadyl.. It is far better to prevent a GI issue than to cure an Ulcer..My Tyler's Neurologist at Purdue University Veterinary teaching Hospital told me that dogs with IVDD have a tendency to have acid problems and she sent him home with Pepcid AC along with his other medications. Please encourage your friend to keep Lilly on crate rest 24/7 as Sabrina told you.. • "Strict confinement is crucial and is considered the cornerstone of conservative therapy for IVDD (the dog is kept in the cage at all times and only taken outside to relieve him/herself). In order to accomplish the goals of preventing further extrusion of the nucleus of the disk and to promote healing of the outer layers (the annulus) of the disk, strict confinement is necessary. Activity can easily push more of the nucleus into the spinal canal and dramatically worsen the neurological status. It is not uncommon to see dogs that have “gone down” after a short course of pain relievers given without insuring that the owner would enforce strict cage rest." Dr Larry Carpenter DVM MS ACVS sites.google.com/site/sturgisvet/small-animal-services/faq-s-about-disk-disease ========= |
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Sabrina
Helpful Member
My Charley-dog, a Dodger'sList grad enjoying life!
Posts: 471
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Post by Sabrina on Aug 22, 2013 20:32:38 GMT -7
Linda, so glad to hear you have shared Dodger's List resources with your friend! I'm new to IVDD myself, and I was just beside myself until I found Dodger's List and read and re-read everything I could! Show your friend these page - it helped me so much to know that IVDD itself isn't going to keep my dog from having a great quality of life: YES, Your Dog CAN Have a Great Quality of Life! - www.dodgerslist.com/index/SDUNCANquality.htmSuccess Stories - Dodgerslist Graduates - www.dodgerslist.com/monthstory.htm))Hugs(( to you and Lilly's mom! - Sabrina |
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Post by flipflops on Aug 23, 2013 6:04:02 GMT -7
Thanks everyone. I'm going with them for her laser treatment today, I'll discuss the Pepcid with the vet and hopefully get her meds refilled so they get through the weekend. We need to discuss increasing her pain meds.
I'll show her the comments on this thread, I wanted her to realize that all this is specifically for Lilly and her disc problem. We just set up an appt with a board certified neurologist.
Thanks for your help everyone!
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Post by janlynn on Aug 23, 2013 6:51:34 GMT -7
Hi Linda, I'm Janet and just 3 weeks new to Dodgerslist too.
Print out the medication list, if you haven't done so already. When I showed it to Chopper's Vet, she increased his meds. I boldly went down the list and asked which one(s) would benefit Chopper and then asked why or why not? We already were prepared to add Pepcid with his Prednisone and give it 30 minutes prior.
We actually got the prescriptions filled at Walmart for $4 each. The Pepcid was over the counter and $0.98 for I believe a dozen tablets, which we cut in half. You can check the dosage according to the dog's weight, so we had to cut Chopper's.
Chopper had acupuncture last Saturday and improved dramatically by the next day. So talk to the Vet about this option prior to any surgery. For $80, he had one treatment and a vitamin B-12 injection down his spine. The Vet gave him several injections from the same syringe, but injecting the vitamin next to each disc point on both sides of his spine - of course, changing the needle after each injection. Chopper never made a peep during the whole treatment and actually calmed down after just 7 minutes into the 25 minute timeframe.
Since we were not sure if Chopper had a ruptured or injured neck disc or a pinched nerve, even an x-ray could produce dangerous results because they have to put them under sedation and move their body into different poses to get all of the required shots. We were too nervous about that option and decided to treat conservatively first.
Our new Vet had a dachshund up and walking by the 2nd treatment of acupuncture and that dog was dragging it's back legs when they brought it in. Usually they do at least 3-4 treatments and wait 2 weeks in between each one. So many people report great results with acupuncture before deciding on surgery. I hope you all can get guidance.
Wishing you all the best and praying for Lilly.
Oh, Chopper has gone back to 12 pounds with his crate rest and they would like to see him at 10 pounds - just so you all are prepared to help drop Lilly's weight. It doesn't seem like a lot to us, but for a dachshund, it helps take pressure off their backs.
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