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Post by Jean & Mimi on Apr 18, 2017 12:27:19 GMT -7
I have a question. I have a trip that my family must take overnight on 5/6. The dogs come with us. Mimi is very used to travelling in her travel crate. I can line the crate with a nonskid foam pad, and put extra blankets around her so she cannot wiggle around. The crate sits flat in our vehicle and we can/will wedge it in to prevent a lot of movement.
I know it is not ideal to travel with her on crate rest but I have no choice. What else can I do to keep her safe? The expen and her "crating" supplies will come with us so the setup will be the same. Is there anything else I can do?
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Post by Romy & Frankie on Apr 18, 2017 13:33:29 GMT -7
Sometimes traveling is unavoidable. It seems like you have thought things out out with the extra blankets to pad out the crate and wedging it to prevent movement.
Some other things to consider are:
Have your vet give you a copy of Mimi's file on the disc episode. In case you would need an ER or a new vet's help, the new vet will have the history, meds on hand with the vet visit.
-- Have on hand a sedative just in case Mimi needs calming. You might try one dose at home just so you know how she reacts. Give feedback to your vet if adjustment is needed. Some sedatives work the opposite for some dogs...they get wired up rather than calmed. Ask your vet about use of Trazadone for example.
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Post by Jean & Mimi on Apr 24, 2017 5:19:44 GMT -7
4/24 Update - So Mimi is doing fine, but was driving me crazy since Friday. She kept having this shivering thing going on...until I finally figured our she was cold. When Mimi is having "pain" shivering, her whole body constantly shakes and she lays very still in one spot (or if it is really bad she moves positions constantly). When she is having cold shivering, the shivers come from the front of her body and are intermittent, and she will ask for belly rubs and eat etc. I was freaking out that she was having pain again until Saturday when I put a blanket around her and she stopped. It's a bit chilly in the morning and she is cold I am posting this in case anyone else is having a hard time figuring out if their dog is cold or in pain. This morning she was doing it again when we came in from outside. So I gave her my bathrobe and she did the dog curl underneath and was fine. That's the other thing - she will lay very straight if she is in pain...no dog curls, no relaxing on her side.So I am going to chat with her vet later this week about the best way to determine if she still needs to be on Rimadyl. I want to take her off when I am home and can easily observe for pain. We need to reduce her pain meds to at least see what is going on.
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PaulaM
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Member since 2007: surgery, conservative . Montana, USA
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Post by PaulaM on Apr 24, 2017 8:36:15 GMT -7
Jean, good observational skills and detective work in narrowing down the cause of shivering!
Seeing two or more signs of pain is very helpful in determining shivering from cold OR shivering is pain.
shivering, trembling, yelping when picked up or moved, reluctant to move much in crate such as shift positions slow to move, tight tense tummy, can’t find a comfortable position, arched back pinned back ears not their normal perky interested in life selves
Got our fingers crossed for a successful no pain surfacing with the stop of pain meds and the Rimadyl.
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Post by Jean & Mimi on Apr 25, 2017 10:01:40 GMT -7
Brief update - spoke to my vet today. We are going to slowly back off the pain meds before stopping the Rimadyl. She remembers how sensitive Mimi was the last time to any change so we take the slow route again.
In two days (we want her on all meds for a full two weeks), we will start backing of Tramadol - removing one dose, then waiting two days, then removing the next dose, etc. Then we will back off the mid dose of Gabapentin - since as a standard Mimi was already on Gabapentin 2x per day before the incident - for control of remnant nerve pain. Once we do that, then we will drop the Rimadyl and see what happens. Of course, if we see pain during any of these transitions, we will dose up again.
I will keep you posted.
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PaulaM
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Member since 2007: surgery, conservative . Montana, USA
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Post by PaulaM on Apr 25, 2017 10:29:55 GMT -7
Jean, every dog is different. Your vet knows Mimi and this sounds like a good plan of a slow backing off of pain meds. Got fingers double crossed all the swelling will be gone at the stop of Rimadyl!
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Post by Jean & Mimi on May 1, 2017 5:03:45 GMT -7
5/1/17-Quick Update. Slow and steady wins the race. Off Tramadol in the am and afternoon. Last night was her last dose of tramadol. Hopefully things should continue to go well. Also dropped down on the gabapentin to 1.1 from 1.3 with no issues. She will never be off gabapentin completely - as she takes it for chronic nerve pain in her leg. But we will get her off the middle day dosage.
She seems happier since she is off the tramadol. She was fine before but now she is wagging constantly, barking when we leave the room and if you even glance her way she is on her back begging for a belly rub. Fingers crossed for a continued successful taper.
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PaulaM
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Member since 2007: surgery, conservative . Montana, USA
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Post by PaulaM on May 1, 2017 7:54:25 GMT -7
Jean,, that's really good news regaining personality, no pain on the continued backing off of pain meds. Got our fingers crossed along with you.
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Post by Jean & Mimi on May 4, 2017 11:44:21 GMT -7
One question...how soon would I see pain after not giving the Rimadyl? Do I need to wait a few days or would it be seen quickly? I ask because I did the slow decrease from prednisone the last time and I'm not sure what to expect with the dropping of the nsaid.
I would think it would be quickly, but I would like to confirm. Thanks all.
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Post by Romy & Frankie on May 4, 2017 12:49:39 GMT -7
You would see the resurfacing of pain rather quickly if there was still swelling in the spinal cord. It would not be a few days.
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PaulaM
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Post by PaulaM on May 4, 2017 17:53:22 GMT -7
Jean, it is hard to predict when still existing pain might resurface on the stop of a NSAID or taper of a steroid. Every dog can have a differing metabolism on how fast their body excretes and processes meds.
Since it is recommended a 5-7 days washout if there is to be a switch NSAID<-> Steroid or other NSAID, maybe it would be up to 7 days when the body typically has fully cleared the NSAID from the body. IF a dog metabolizes faster, then could be sooner when the level no longer is working on swelling.
Prednisone is controlled by how long the vet Rx's the taper days. Some dogs will have pain resurface right away as the dose drop in the body and some more nearing the end of the vet-prescribed taper.
Got our fingers crossed that you will not see any pain at all. Keep us posted.
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Post by Jean & Mimi on May 5, 2017 6:16:06 GMT -7
Ok, that makes sense. I will continue to watch. We are down one dose of rimadyl a day and will drop the other dose on Sunday. So now she just has her morning gabapentin (reduced to .8) and her evening gabapentin (reduced to .8). This was the dose she was on prior to her latest ivdd episode - so essentially she will be back to her regular meds only on Monday. She will of course finish out he 8 weeks of crate rest which will be on June 7th. You can so tell she feels fine. Took her out to potty and she tried to jump up on my leg to get affection (she would not have tried to do this when she was starting this flare up). I stopped that (she knows she is not allowed) and instead dropped down to give her a pet. To which she rolled on her back and gave me her belly....of course And then our other dog came over and gave me her belly too
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Post by Jean & Mimi on May 11, 2017 8:06:59 GMT -7
Update 5/11/17...4 weeks into crate rest. Has been off Rimadyl for 5 days (last dose was Friday 5/5). Gabapentin back to normal dosages - morning and evening. She continues to remain pain free. Just four more weeks of crate rest and I can have my girl back.
She is getting sneaky though....she scratches her crate like she needs to go outside and then goes out and just sits in the grass. The weather is supposed to be really bad this weekend, but I am going to try to take her crate outside more so she can sit in the sun.
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PaulaM
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Post by PaulaM on May 11, 2017 9:08:38 GMT -7
Wonderful news that all swelling appears to be gone! Yay! I think it is very good mental stimulation to be outside, reading the neighborhood newspaper of smells and odors and monitoring the birds and squirrels! I lucked into a pack N play...it was perfect to move around on my deck as me and my patient enjoyed summertime hours outdoors.
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Post by Jean & Mimi on May 19, 2017 7:30:55 GMT -7
5/19/17 update - we are into week six of crate rest. Still no pain, still healing, but getting bored. Working on some training with her - getting her to put her face into my palm with 1/4 of a 3 cal treat as a reward.
I am glad she is still on Gabapentin (although at a significantly lower dose than she was during her IVDD crisis stage and only 2x per day) as I still see her get a nerve "zing" to her leg every once in a while (she will stop and look at her leg, then nibble on it a bit). [15 lbs Gabapentin suspension 30mgs/0.6 mL: .9 ml (45 mg) 2x per day]
This happened a lot after her first IVDD episode. It went away after a while, but it is back again - no surprise. Please note this is not pain from her spine - but nerve damage. I hope it heals after a while again. Otherwise she is her sparky, belly-rub requesting self.
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PaulaM
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Post by PaulaM on May 19, 2017 8:24:52 GMT -7
Just curious and to confirm, now many mL is the current dose of Gabapentin that is controlling neuropathic pain?
Mimi sounds very good and promising to lead up to graduation day in 2 weeks!
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Post by Jean & Mimi on May 19, 2017 9:48:56 GMT -7
She is on .9 ml - so 45 mg 2x per day. This was the "post-ivdd" dose our vet and I worked out the last time. We got her down to .7 ml about 6 months after the last ivdd episode. That's our goal now too, but our vet isn't concerned about her dosage at all right now. Knows the nerves take time to heal.
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Post by Jean & Mimi on May 26, 2017 5:14:02 GMT -7
Starting week 7... two more to go. All going well...just waiting the last two weeks for full healing. For those just going through this...you will get through this and your dog has every chance of recovering. This time was much different then the first time. The first time we had many set backs during conservative treatment - taken off prednisone too soon and lots of pain. But found a vet who would work with us. We did probably 4-6 weeks on prednisone with 1/3 of that being a really slow taper. We got her on the right pain meds and then she was able to get her personality back and recover. Who cares if your dog has a slightly wobbly walk after this is over - they don't care. When Mimi runs, she runs like a rabbit...using both back legs together. She has no idea that anything is wrong So hang in there...it is soooo scary going through it, but it will get better.
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PaulaM
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Post by PaulaM on May 26, 2017 8:00:58 GMT -7
Jean, thanks for the update. You are right, getting full pain control right away with the right pain meds, means a dog can heal in comfort while the anti-inflammatory drug may take 7-30 days to resolve the cause of pain. Finding an IVDD knowledgeable vet makes all the difference.
Glad to hear Mimi is on her way to graduation of healing her disc in two more weeks!
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Post by Jean & Mimi on Jun 1, 2017 7:57:54 GMT -7
Week 7...all still good. We had thunderstorms last night and Mimi got upset. I never realized that storms bothered her because she always slept right through them when she was sleeping with me. Had to go get in her ex-pen with her (it is set up in our bedroom at night) to give her comfort. A few minutes of love and belly rubs helped.
One more week to go...June 7th is graduation day!
We will gradually let her out of her crate. We already use ramps for outside and inside so no prep needed there. She will stay in her crate in the daytime when we aren't home on only be let out when we are home to watch her. Cannot wait for cuddles again!
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PaulaM
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Member since 2007: surgery, conservative . Montana, USA
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Post by PaulaM on Jun 1, 2017 11:34:40 GMT -7
Jean, sounds like all is prepared for graduation day and the incremental introduction back to family life over the course of a couple of weeks. I bet Mimi will be raring to go, go go. But who wants a dog with sore muscles from over doing things and not being able to distinguish muscle vs a disc problem should there be tenderness/pain.
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Post by Jean & Mimi on Jun 7, 2017 5:06:54 GMT -7
Graduation day for my girl! She was a very happy dog to be able to walk around in our bedroom on the carpet this morning as I was getting ready for work. She was even happier to have me put her on the bed for a bunch of belly rubs. Slow introduction to life again...only allowed to walk in carpeted rooms until fully strong on back end, crated when we are not home. Thanks all!
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Post by Pauliana on Jun 7, 2017 14:19:54 GMT -7
Happy crate rest graduation,Jean and little Mimi! Thanks for your help on the forum too!
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