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Post by julienne on Apr 11, 2013 12:25:44 GMT -7
Hello everyone, my name is Julie and my miniature dapple dachshund, Hank, is having some complications. I took him to the emergency vet last night at around 8 pm after noticing him shaking, acting differently, not wanting to move around, and yelping when my mom tried to pick him up. The odd part is, after completing a thorough back/neck check, the veterinarian could not locate anything unusual. He was walking around fine, wagging his tail, etc. The vet ordered x-rays and a buprenorphine HCL injection for Hank. She also prescribed rimadyl and methocarbamol for pain and anti inflammation. We were allowed to take him home that evening, but received a phone call from the vet saying that he had calcification in one of the plates in his neck, and a narrowing in his spinal column. I have no idea what this means, and they hung up before I could ask any questions. (I'll be headed over there after I pick up my dad from the airport to ask more questions.) I have another dachshund, Jack, who hurt his back about 3 years ago and required emergency surgery to remove the ruptured disc(s) in his back, and left him a paraplegic. After a lot of love and TLC, he has regained the ability to walk, but still wobbles and has accidents inside fairly often. However, Hank's case is so different from Jack's that I don't know what to do. I have him in a kennel right now with rolled towels lining the cage. He is lying on a pillow with a thick blanket on top, which will soon be traded for one of my memory foam pillows. Please help, I am very confused and nervous as to what I should do to help Hank. Bear in mind I am only 16 years old, but am very determined to help my little doxie. Thank you in advance.
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PaulaM
Moderator. 
Member since 2007: surgery, conservative . Montana, USA
Posts: 19,928
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Post by PaulaM on Apr 11, 2013 12:58:36 GMT -7
Julie, welcome to Dodgerslist. Hank would be a very good candidate for conservative treatment.... IF, if you can commit to 1 00% STRICT crate rest 24/7 only out at potty times for 8 weeks. 100% STRICT crate rest 24/7 only out to potty for a full 8 weeks …. No laps, no couch, no sleeping in bed with you, no meandering, scooting or dragging around during potty times. No baths, no chiro (aka VOM). In other words do everything you can to limit the vertebrae in the back from moving and putting pressure on the bad disc. The recovery suite (wire crate, ex-pen, baby crib, pack n play) is the only surface that is firm, supportive for the spine, not inclining, always horizontal and keeps a dog from darting off at a TV doorbell and safe from other pets and kids from bothering them. The rest of the details of doing crate rest to ensure the best recovery in this excellent document: www.dodgerslist.com/literature/CrateRRP.htm Hank is going to be dependent on yours and your parents skills in studying to learn his disease. There is not a better place than to start with this over view so you know the meds, why they are used and for how long. Also you will learn it is important to advocate for a stomach protector any time Rimadyl is being use. The protector is called Pepcid AC or the generic name is famotidine. Here is the first important link to get up to speed on disc disease: www.dodgerslist.com/literature/healingpage.htm When you finish do proceed to finish all the readings there. When you can give us the complete information on his pain meds. The exact dose in mg. and how often you are supposed to give them. Also let us know that his pain is fully under control now -- no shivering, trembling, yelping when picked up or moved, reluctant/slow to move head or body, tight hard tummy. Often it takes being at the anti-inflamamtory dose of prednisone (5mg 2x/day) for 1-2 weeks or even for some dogs more like a month before all the swelling is gone. On the taper the dose is lowered to less than the anti-flammatory dose and that is the time to assess just how well reduction of swelling is going by observing for pain. Let us hear back, we know Hank is in your good hands, because you have been reading...good job on the memory foam pillow!! |
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Post by julienne on Apr 11, 2013 15:09:44 GMT -7
Thank you so much for responding! I have been reading the information on this website and it is truly helpful, I wish I had discovered it when Jack had his surgery! I am truly devoted to my dogs, and will do anything I can to help Hank. However, I am a full time high school student and both of my parents work, is it possible to follow the 8 week schedule with such a hectic schedule? I can take him out for a potty break before I leave school, then hopefully at least one of my parents can take him out during the day, and then after school he'll be back under my care again. Does that sound okay? I'm very worried that my parents will be more lenient while I'm at school. Actually, I'm very worried about everything!
I have switched Hank's pillow to a memory foam one. His cage is a bit too big, but I have lined the sides with rolled up towels. As soon as I figure out how to upload pictures, I will! I will buy a bowl to hang on the cage ASAP, as well as a harness for him. Am I looking for a particular type of harness, or will any harness do? Is it okay if he scratches the bed, burrows, etc, or am I supposed to stop him when I catch him doing so? He's acting completely like his normal self, I took him outside for a potty break on his leash and he started scratching his back in the grass. I told him no and took him inside, but the look on his face broke my heart. He's showing no signs of pain, acting completely like his happy, playful self.
Hank is currently taking 1/4 of a 75 mg tablet of Rimadyl every 12 hours, and 1/4 of a 500 mg tablet of methocarbamol every 8 hours. I was instructed to finish the bottles. I read I should give him 5 mg of Pepcid AC 30 minutes before the Rimadyl, is that correct?
I'm still a little lost when it comes down to IVDD. The vet never diagnosed him with it, but only mentioned his narrowing spinal column? Is this common in dogs with IVDD? The X-rays do not show a ruptured disc or anything of that sorts, just the calcification on his neck and the narrowing of the spinal column.. I'm going to the vet tonight to verify exactly what they meant by this, and double check giving Hank Pepcid AC.
Thank you so much for responding. I appreciate it very much, and will graciously accept any advice anyone has to offer.
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Post by Nancy & Polly on Apr 11, 2013 16:45:05 GMT -7
I must say, you are a very impressive 16 year old. It sounds to me as though your dog is in good hands. Make sure your parents understand the importance of 100% crate rest. If it helps, talk to them in terms of money. If you can make a success of the crate treatment, they will save a great deal of money in vet bills. Maybe that will help them take it seriously. Can you get your parents to read some of the information on this site?
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Post by Linda Stowe on Apr 11, 2013 16:56:00 GMT -7
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Post by julienne on Apr 11, 2013 19:31:32 GMT -7
Thank you for the compliment, pollysmom! I try as hard as possible to not come across as the usual teenager.
I went to the emergency vet to clarify exactly what they found on the X-rays. Turns out Hank has some calcification everywhere along his back as well as narrowing of disc space. Just to make sure, I asked if there was any reason Hank could not take Pepcid AC, and I got the response "It won't do anything, but it won't hurt him." Needless to say I'd rather be safe than sorry! I'll be giving him 5mg 30 minutes before his Rimadyl.
As far as crate rest, this is a lot harder than I expected. Hank is pretty restless, and is beginning to whine to be let out. I'm 99% sure it's not out of pain, but for attention. He's always been one to cry when he's lonely or just wants some love. As a matter of fact, he's been starting to jump up in his cage, what can I do to stop/prevent that?
Thank you so much for that article, Mrs. Stowe! It's very informative.
Pollysmom, I think I'll try that approach. My parents are eager to avoid another $5,000 on dachshund surgery!
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Post by Pauliana on Apr 11, 2013 20:07:38 GMT -7
Julie, Hank is so lucky to have a well informed advocate such as yourself! You are reading and learning all about the IVDD enemy and that will help Hank fight this battle.. Whining is a behavior problem that can be quite irritating. He may sit quietly but not jump against the side of the crate. Let us know if heis being rambuctious or just whinning. Be aware you might be inadvertently training for unwanted behavior. To dogs rewards are: food, looking at them, talking to them, eye contact, approaching the crate, petting. So anytime you see unwanted behavior ignore it, turn your back, leave the room if you have to. Anytime your dog is sitting or lying down quietly, give a reward. Soon your dog will learn which of the behaviors receive reward.
To calm him in the crate you might try some of these suggestions. <li>
</li><li>Put a garment you have been wearing and have not washed in the crate. Check out some mild calmers such as using any oral calmer in combination with a Pheromone diffuser seems to work best. It takes several days for these to start working - it isn't immediate but they are a much better option if you can avoid heavy duty prescription sedatives. Farnum's Comfort Zone with D.A.P. www.petcomfortzone.com/ [pheromone diffuser] with one oral calmer from below: - ANXITANE® S chewable tabs contain 50 mg L-Theanine, an amino acid that acts neurologically to help keep dogs calm, relaxed www.virbacvet.com/products/detail/anxitane-l-theanine-chewable-tablets or tinyurl.com/atxc8l3
- Composure Soft Chews are colostrum based like calming mother's milk and contain 21 mg of L-Theanine.
www.vetriscience.com/composure-soft-dogs-MD-LD.php [Composure]
- Rescue Remedy is a liquid herb combo to help with relaxation www.bachrescueremedypet.com
</li><li>At night, try placing the crate on a sturdy bedside table to sleep next to you. During the day try the coffee table or the dinning room table so there will bea view out a window and a better perspective on what is going on in the house from a high.Make the crate or ex-pen more cozy by draping a blanket over part of the top. Play classical music or one of the wildlife TV shows.</li></div>
It's hard since you have to be at school all day and your parents work. Hopefully he will sleep during those times when no one is home.. When you are home, he can still be part of things at home just by putting his kennel or crate where you spend the most time. I had a living room recovery pen for Tyler as well as his sleeping crate in our bedroom and we had another crate upstairs in our office. He was with us no matter where we were in the house.. It helped to calm him and he didn't fall into depression this way..
Sending healing wishes for Hank.. Keep up the excellent way you are handling things!
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Post by Cal & Boner on Apr 11, 2013 21:01:16 GMT -7
Hi Julie, My dachshund also just got diagnosed with a calcified disc- but in the lower region of his spine. I was wondering how Hank is doing with the Rimadyl. My dachshund was prescribed Previcox, but could not tolerate it- so the vet has suggested Rimidyl as an alternative. I am still considering it. I sympathize with how hard it is to keep them on strict rest. I just keep telling myself that is it best for him in the long run. Hope Hank is doing better  CAL |
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Post by julienne on Apr 11, 2013 21:26:33 GMT -7
Thank you for the compliments and tips, Pauliana! I appreciate them very much. Yes, Hank does have some behavioral issues, most of them originated in his prior home (where he was abused for being a stubborn dachshund) but I have to admit that he does get coddled too much in our home. He whines for love and attention and sometimes steps up on the bars of the cage. I immediately tell him "NO" in a firm voice and most of the time he jumps off right away. I hope with training and rewarding his good, quiet behavior will yield a happy and calm Hank. And thank you for the links! I will definitely check them out and look into trying one if Hank continues to be this restless!
Cal, so far Hank has been a little constipated with all the medication. But his stool is normal colored and solid- no blood or black coloration. I am giving him 5 mg Pepcid AC 30 minutes before giving the Rimadyl to him. So far, so good. And thank you for the warm wishes, sending some back your way!
Thank you to all who have responded and sent well wishes, I have learned so much in a day it's almost overwhelming! I appreciate all of your advice and support, it really means a lot to me in Hank's time of need. It's extremely comforting to know that there is hope for my little dapple doxie!
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PaulaM
Moderator.
Member since 2007: surgery, conservative . Montana, USA
Posts: 19,928
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Post by PaulaM on Apr 11, 2013 22:05:28 GMT -7
Julie, we all are very pleased to see how much information you have absorbed and are already applying to help Hank! Good job at the vet on getting the OK for Pepcid AC. Jumping against the side of the crate is too rambunctious for his disc and the spinal cord. How about draping a blanket so it hangs down at his eye level. That should discourage the jumping because when he jumps he won't be able to see anything. Hopefully you'll be able to track down those calmers Pauliana mentioned to take the edge off and help Hank relax. Pumpkin is a magical fruit - its high fiber can firm up stools and help with diarrhea or loosen the stool to help with constipation. The amount of water in the diet makes all the difference. To loosen the stool, add equal parts water to each kibble meal along with a teaspoon of plain canned pureed pumpkin 1x a day. To firm up the stool add 1 teaspoon pumpkin to kibble and no extra water 1x a day. [Note other fiber alternatives: really ripe mashed fresh pear, just take off the peel off; microwaved and mashed peeled sweet potoato.] Lots of other great tips to help crate rest go smoother on our List of supplies: www.dodgerslist.com/literature/cratesupplies.htm |
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Post by julienne on Apr 12, 2013 10:07:24 GMT -7
First night of crate rest went well. I slept on the couch next to him to keep him company and be nearby if he needed to go potty. I appreciate the pumpkin tips, Hank is very constipated this morning.
I went around town looking for a new vet since the one we took Hank to was an emergency vet, and has a very very high consultation price. I found a clinic that is very knowledgeable about IVDD and how to treat it conservatively, and will recommend me to a neurologist if further surgery is necessary. I was ecstatic to find them!
Hank is having some issues during potty time. He would rather sit and bask in the sun than go to the restroom. He wasn't potty trained the normal way because we have a doggy door and he simply learned by following the other dogs outside. So simply telling him "go potty" yields nothing but a wagging tail and a confused Hank. Any suggestions on this?
Thanks everyone!
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PaulaM
Moderator.
Member since 2007: surgery, conservative . Montana, USA
Posts: 19,928
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Post by PaulaM on Apr 12, 2013 11:30:23 GMT -7
I would recommend to set up a 6 foot diameter fenced area outdoors. You can use an ex-pen or some of that poke in the ground garden edging fencing to form the fenced area. Carry him to and from the potty place. Use a sling if he is the least bit wobbly to help keep his spine aligned and the butt from falling over. snipurl.com/2354smg [photo of wire fence] Give him a minute or 2...if not attempt to poop, then carry him back inside and try again in an hour. He can be trained to potty on command...it takes a number of times seeing he is just about to poop...like circling, starting to squat where you give the command. Then at the time he actually poops or pees you lavishly praise him. You have the patience to teach and Hank loves you and will desire your attention and lavish praises when does the right thing. Do make sure his kibble is soaked and soft with an equal amount of broth/water as there is kibble. That soaking and 1 teaspoon of high fiber 1x a day should be very helpful in combating constipation. |
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Post by julienne on Apr 12, 2013 22:07:56 GMT -7
Hectic day today! I had all of my wisdom teeth removed Wednesday morning and the pain is now in full swing.
Just a little update, Hank is doing well today. The pumpkin worked miracles and his bowel movements are much smoother now. (TMI, sorry!) I will definitely be working on his potty training, it will be a lot easier for my parents if I can teach him to go on command.
Does anyone have the link to the video on how to properly pick up dachshunds? I saw it somewhere on the site earlier but can't seem to find it again. Thanks in advance!
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Post by Cindy & Sophie on Apr 13, 2013 4:20:21 GMT -7
Hi Julie this is the link to the lifting video :
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Post by julienne on Apr 13, 2013 22:40:46 GMT -7
Thank you so much for the link! I showed it to everyone in my family. This is Jack, my 10 year old dachshund! He successfully recovered from a disc rupture over 3 years ago. 
And this is Hank! The first picture is about a year old, and the second was today while he was napping.
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Post by Cindy & Sophie on Apr 14, 2013 4:20:57 GMT -7
Love your pictures!
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PaulaM
Moderator.
Member since 2007: surgery, conservative . Montana, USA
Posts: 19,928
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Post by PaulaM on Apr 14, 2013 9:56:02 GMT -7
Julie, what a wonderful recovery suite you have set up for Hank. Thanks for the pictures...Hank and Jack are very handsome guys! Kudos to you for helping educate your family on how to lift and carry a doxie. If it fits your budget, please order our $3 DVD. It is a wonderful resource to add to your arsenal of educational items. If you ever have an opportunity to give a speech in school or to a group you are in, the DVD would add a wonderful audio-visual aspect to it. Friends, family and those who will be caring for your dogs should also watch this DVD; plus don't forget to order one DVD for your vet www.dodgerslist.com/store/DVDorder.htm It feels sooooo good to know you may have helped another dog shorten the time of pain or even have saved their life from needless euthanasia!
Also ask Linda for a packet of free educational literature I keep the business sized cards on me to hand out at the post office, waiting in line at the grocery store, sitting at the dentist office.... you just never know when you'll strike up a conservation with the owner of an iVDD prone breed... short legged and small breed. Here's the link to get your packet of FREE literature...... it is a good feeling to know YOU may have saved a dog from unnecessary pain or loss of life. Go here today to request your packet: www.dodgerslist.com/literature/litorder.htm |
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Post by Cal & Boner on Apr 14, 2013 11:36:49 GMT -7
Your dogs are so adorable- that first pic of Jack is too cute! My dachshund, Boner, is also a constant digger/burrower as you mentioned in an earlier post. I have finally figured out that making the bed just right in his crate area is key- especially having the blankets/towels tight on top of the memory pillows- much like making your own bed and getting the bottom sheet tight against the mattress- I have found that this keeps him from constantly trying to rearrange his bedding.
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Post by julienne on Apr 14, 2013 14:20:32 GMT -7
Thank you, clbs! Your dachshund is super cute and looks pretty comfy in your avatar!
Paula, I will look into ordering a couple DVD's next Friday. (Payday!) I'd love to give one to my sister, she owns a feisty miniature dachshund as well. Thank you for letting me know!!
Thank you so much, Cal! If that's boner in your avatar, he is a cutie!!! I've always loved long haired doxies. I appreciate the tip, Hank loves to burrow and I woke up this morning to find all the towels rearranged! I guess he just needs more blankets on top of his pillow.
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Post by julienne on Apr 16, 2013 21:16:38 GMT -7
Hello everyone. Hank is doing fine and dandy, but I have some concerns/questions. He's about to finish his rimadyl (2 doses left) and I'm wondering if that's okay? Should I ask for a refill? How do I know he no longer needs it? He has about 5-7 methocarbinol doses left, and the same questions apply. Any advice is greatly appreciated, thank you in advance. |
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Post by Sherry Layman on Apr 17, 2013 11:14:26 GMT -7
The Rimadyl is the anti-imflammatory and was used to reduce the swelling from the disc putting pressure on the nerve. Generally the medication used for this purpose is used for the full dose as prescribed by the vet and unless the dog is showing worsening signs then the course is complete and no refills are issued. You will want to be sure to keep in communication with your vet regarding Hank's progress should he show any signs of his disc getting worse again.
The Methocarbamol is a muscle relaxant used to reduce the muscle spasms which are very painful and common with disc episodes. It is best to stop this medication prior to the end of the course of anti-inflammatory (in Hank's case Rimadyl) to be sure he is not in any pain. If he has pain off the Methocarbamol you should restart it and contact your vet as it may be necessary to continue the anti-inflammatory for a longer period of time.
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Post by julienne on Apr 19, 2013 19:10:15 GMT -7
URGENT UPDATE:
Hank has been off both medications for at least 3 days now, remadyl is completely gone but there are 3 remaining doses of methocarbamol. Noticed mild shivering that occurred when I took him outside an assumed it was the cold weather. Noticed he did not want to shake his head (like he usually did) and back legs were the teensiest wobbly. Please help. I am in tears as I do not want this to worsen and have to go through this all over again. I called the vet about refilling his prescriptions for both and they said they would call me back ASAP, since it was an emergency vet and the doctors were busy. Called another vet that seemed familiar with ivdd but they are only taking emergencys for $70 consultation fee since it is after hours. Do I give hank the remaining methocarbamol until tomorrow morning when I can hopefully get more Remadyl and metho? PLEASE HELP. thank you
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Post by Pauliana on Apr 19, 2013 19:35:31 GMT -7
Julie,
I hope your ER Vet returns your call ASAP.. I would restart on the Methocarbamol and when they call you back, ask for a prescription for the Rimadyl and Methocabomal to be continued since Hank is showing signs of pain returning. Tell them what you have observed exactly.. Remember his conservative treatment only started 9 days ago, healing takes time and this just means he needs the medications for a little while longer. Many dogs need two weeks to even a month at the anti inflammatory dose for the swelling to go down. Hank is getting the best of care from you.. Don't panic, reassure Hank that everything is going to be ok and believe that yourself, because it will be.
Hugs, Pauliana
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Post by julienne on Apr 19, 2013 20:27:58 GMT -7
I called my emergency vet and they told me they will not refill his prescription unless we bring him in or take him to a daytime vet... I can not afford the $80 consultation fee again on top of the $50 his medications cost. Can I try to extend the methocarbamol doses to every 10 hours instead of 8 to make them last longer? There are only two doses left. I touched Hank along the side and he tensed up and twitched a little. I am so concerned and my parents think he's fine. Please help. I think the earliest I can get him in is Monday. Please help. Any advice greatly appreciated as I am in tears and feel hopeless.
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Post by Linda Stowe on Apr 19, 2013 20:40:58 GMT -7
Julie, did you give him some methocarbamol yet. Can't you get ahold of your regular vet tomorrow.
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Post by julienne on Apr 19, 2013 20:45:10 GMT -7
Yes, I did give Hank a dose of methocarbamol. He has two doses left. I will try to contact a daytime vet tomorrow to see if I can take him in ASAP. Will he be okay until then? Is he worsening because he's not on remadyl right now?
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Post by Linda Stowe on Apr 19, 2013 20:57:23 GMT -7
Yes, he is probably seeming worse since hes not on the Rimadyl. The swelling has not completely gone down and he will need to stay on the anti-inflammatory (Rimadyl) awhile longer. This happens frequently. Does he seem to be in pain?
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Post by julienne on Apr 19, 2013 21:03:46 GMT -7
At this exact moment he has shaken his head, walked in a circle and began burrowing under a blanket in his recovery suite. So he does seen to be pain free for the moment. I should rephrase my question : is Hank's medical condition worsening by not being on the remadyl at this moment? For example, are his discs under more pressure because of the lack of anti inflammatory?
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Post by Cal & Boner on Apr 19, 2013 23:46:26 GMT -7
Hi Julie, I just wanted to try and give you what encouragement I can and let you know my thoughts are with you and Hank. I think that Hank and my dachshund, Boner, are in similar conditions with the calcified disk. Boner is going to be off Rimadyl for the first day starting tomorrow- so I am going to be looking for signs of pain all day. If they return, I have been advised to get him back on the Rimadyl immediately. I understand your frustrations with the vet and the awful worry that comes along with him being in pain. I know I am new to this board, but after what seems like endless reading on this condition, I would suggest getting him back on the Rimadyl as soon as possible and keep him on the muscle relaxant. I know that my own vet charges more on the weekends, but they also offer payment plans so that you do not have to pay right away. Do you know if your vet offers this? - it might help you to get him in sooner, before Monday... I know it is so hard to see him in any kind of pain, but don't feel hopeless- it sounds like you are doing an excellent job taking care of him |
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PaulaM
Moderator.
Member since 2007: surgery, conservative . Montana, USA
Posts: 19,928
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Post by PaulaM on Apr 20, 2013 9:01:18 GMT -7
Julie, did you get a phone call into your regular vet to extend the Rx for Rimadyl and his pain meds? How is Hank's pain this morning? The vet phone call should be not a charge, as the vet would only be extending the Rx. Would the medications alone be something your budget would allow? What help can your parents provide dollarwise? Tell the vet of your financial situation to see how he can help Hank. See if any of the generic pain medications at the local pharmacy is something that can help... for example Tramadol is a pain reliever at $4 per 30 tablets. Pepcid AC (famotidne) for the stomach. Here is more in formation on the $4 generic programs. www.dodgerslist.com/literature/IVDDcourse/medications_used.htmlThe goal is to keep Hank's symptoms mild. That means the symptoms are not progressing to damage to the spinal cord (no dragging legs, able to place his paws correctly) Mild symptoms are the signs of pain that show the disc is pushing on the spinal cord, just not hard enough yet to cause nerve damage. Pain can be controlled so Hank can heal in comfort. Pain meds control the pain (methocarbamol and.... Tramadol + gabapentin can also be added if his pain is not fully controlled by methocarbamol) Rimadyl is the med that works on getting the swelling down. Swelling is the cause of the pain. Rimadyl may take more than a couple of weeks to finish the job of getting all the inflammation/swelling down. Since Rimadyl can cause damage to the stomach lining, that is the reason to be proactive with the stomach protector, Pepcid AC. The only way to know if all the swelling has actually been taken care of is the stop of Rimadyl and the backing off of pain meds. Vets start with one course of meds as it is not good to be on any of these meds longer than necessary. So do not be down at heart, the pain is simply Hank's body saying Rimadyl is still needed and also the pain med.... another course is needed. Let us know about Hank and his meds. |
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