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Post by Colleen & Shiloh on May 27, 2014 15:01:24 GMT -7
Hi everyone. I'm not sure if I am posting this in the right place, but here goes.
My name is Colleen and Shiloh was diagnosed with IVDD in August of 2014.
Shiloh is an 8 1/2 year old mixed breed (believe he's Australian Shep/Rott) and weighs 70 pounds.
Here's a bit of his background. He was adopted from the shelter at 2 months old, when he was 4 years old he developed idiopathic epilepsy (June of 2010). In July of 2013 he tested positive for hypothyroidism. He's currently on 3 anti-seizure meds and a med for his thyroid. His seizures are grand mal and he typically will cluster. In August 2013 he had a pretty severe set of clusters and his Phenobarbital dosage was upped. Pheno made Shiloh ataxic but after this set of seizures his back legs weren't getting back to his normal (a tipsy sailor). I scheduled him with the vet who thought that his seizure meds were the problem. When he continued to have walking issues (his back legs scissor and his paws drag the ground, he never gave any indication of pain) I took him back to the vet who did x-rays on his hind end and legs. The x-rays came back clear and the vet sent us to a specialist for MRI to rule out brain tumor.
They did 2 MRI's, one on the head the other at the middle of his back. Shiloh was diagnosed with Type 1 IVDD at T13-L1 and I was told there was nothing they could do for him. They did not prescribe any meds which I'm assuming is because he could walk and by all appearances you would not know that he had an issue unless you were behind him watching him walk.
The vets said that he will get worse and I have researched various sites for a wheelchair should it come to that. I have noticed that lately there is more drag of the back feet and he has trouble keeping his balance on the kitchen floor (now he walks like a drunken sailor!). I've thought about putting socks on him, but he would probably eat them.  Shiloh's toe nails have worn down to the quick so after talking with the vet I have gotten him neoprene boots to wear on our walks.
The good thing is that Shiloh isn't really a big jumper. When he wants to get up on something, like in the car, he will put his front feet up first then his back legs one at a time.
What advice would you have for him? While I know every case and dog is different, based on experiences, what type of progression should I expect to see? Don't really know what to expect, just hoping to hear from those of you who have more experience than I. |
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Post by Pauliana on May 27, 2014 17:36:42 GMT -7
Welcome to Dodgerslist. My name is Pauliana -what's yours? I'm sorry to hear of Shiloh's difficulties but please let your dog know with your utmost confidence that things are going to be ok…because they will. With this disease self education is critical not just so you make sure the right things are being done for the best recovery but for your own emotions. The unknown is simply a scary place. Get ready to fight this disease now and in the future by knowing all things IVDD. There is no better place to start than on our main web page with "Overview: the essentials" and then read all you can as soon as possible. Here's the link www.dodgerslist.com/healingindex.htmShiloh's Epilepsy definitely complicates things with his seizures. Poor dear one. Most likely he had a an IVDD episode during the cluster of seizures he had in Aug 2013 which wasn't treated with 8 weeks of crate rest and medications to deal with the swelling of disc into the spinal cord causing the nerve damage you are seeing such as dragging of back feet, trouble with balance, back legs scissoring etc. Not your fault but the Vet didn't recognize the symtoms of IVDD, being focused on the Epilepsy. The first thing to do is make your home back friendly, this was written with small dogs in mind but you can take some of the ideas and make them work for you and Shiloh: www.dodgerslist.com/literature/protectback.htmMany dogs get along great with wheelcarts. This is a wonderful article "Yes your dog can have a great quality of Life!" It explains what is important to dogs...It really helped me in regards to my Tyler's IVDD, when I read this: www.dodgerslist.com/index/SDUNCANquality.htmThere is no timetable anyone can give you when to expect nerve repair to happen. In fact, there is no time limit for nerves to heal...it can take weeks, months or even a year or longer. However, it is known that neurological function usually returns in the reverse order of the damage. The first big sign you want to look for is that wonderful tail wag! 1. Deep Pain Sensation (Only correctly identified by a specialist.) 2. Tail wagging with joy at seeing you, getting a treat or due to your happy talk. 3. Bladder and bowel control proved by passing the "sniff and pee" test. 4. Leg movement, and then ability to move up into a standing position, and then wobbly walking. 5. Being able to walk with more steadiness and properly placed paws. 6. Ability to walk unassisted and perhaps even run. It is better not to let him try to get in the car himself, a ramp is less stress on the spine and discs. If there is pain or neuro diminishment, dogs can benefit greatly with acupuncture or laser light therapy. These therapies can be started right away to help relieve pain and to also to kick start energy production in nerve cells to sprout. So if this therapy is in your budget, seek out a holistic vet. www.dodgerslist.com/literature/healingacupuncture.htmIs he able to urinate on his own? Does he seem to be getting worse with more loss of function? So glad you joined us, we are here for you and Shiloh! |
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Post by Colleen & Shiloh on May 28, 2014 14:47:40 GMT -7
Thank you for the information. Yes, I think the seizure caused the IVDD and certainly can't fault the vet, because of the high doses of meds, he was already unstable on his feet and it was hard to tell anything else was going on. Shiloh has had a time of it, he's broken teeth and during one seizure broke the bedroom window when he fell into it. Thankfully that didn't hurt him as I believe the drape and blinds protected him from getting cut.
From what the vets (regular and specialist) said he would not get better and over time I should expect him to get worse. At this point, Shiloh acts like a normal dog with the exception of the legs scissoring and occasional hip weakness. He's excited when I come home and go on walks or in the car. No problems eating, bathroom, or indication of pain, early on when you would touch the area of his back it would move/ripple, but doesn't any more. I think the progression is going to be slow going and hope that he will never need a wheelchair, but am prepared if it comes to that. I was curious as to others personal experiences with their babies and other signs to look for as the days/months/years go on.
I wish I could afford a holistic vet, but in the past year alone I've spent somewhere in the area of $7,000-$9,000 on MRI's, spinal taps, emergency room visits, meds, and he's had so much blood drawn he could feed a coven of vampires for a month.
Colleen
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Marjorie
Moderator~ 
Member since 2011. Surgery & Conservative
Posts: 5,724 
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Post by Marjorie on May 28, 2014 17:09:31 GMT -7
Colleen, the only time a dog with IVDD will "get worse" is if they have a disc that tears, ruptures or herniates. IVDD causes degeneration of the discs. When a disc tears or ruptures, disc material extrudes and the damaged disc swells. That disc material and swelling press on the nerves of the spine, causing the nerves to die, which results in nerve damage. The pressure on the nerves also causes pain. When a disc has torn or ruptured, there are two types of treatment, either conservative care or surgery. Some dogs only have one disc episode their entire lives, some have several. Shiloh has been left with some nerve damage which is causing his legs to scissor and the weakness in his hind end. That nerve damage may improve in time. The specialist who diagnosed the IVDD should never have told you that Shiloh would not get better. Nerves can take a very long time to heal, months, even a year or more. If you see a worsening in those neuro functions or any signs of pain (shivering, trembling, yelping when picked up or moved, reluctant/slow to move head or body, nose held to the ground, head held up high, tight hard tummy, arched back, holding leg up flamingo style, not wanting to bear weight on the leg), that would necessitate an urgent vet examination to determine if he is having another disc episode. If another disc episode is diagnosed, then the damaged disc would need to be treated, either through conservative care or surgery. Conservative care consists of a full 8 weeks of strict 100% crate rest, anti-inflammatory to bring the swelling down, pain meds and Pepcid AC to protect from the side effects of the anti-inflammatory. Each time a disc tears or herniates, that particular disc needs to heal. Once the pressure on the nerves of the spine is relieved, either through an anti-inflammatory and crate rest during conservative care or through surgery, the disc can then heal and the nerves can also heal, with the nerve damage reversing. It doesn't appear as though the disc that was damaged in August was ever correctly treated. If you are seeing a worsening of his condition, he should be seen ASAP. If they determine that this is indeed another disc episode (the same disc or another disc has ruptured or torn), conservative care or surgery would be indicated. Until he is seen by a vet, he should be crated to prevent further damage to his spine. Due to the incorrect information you were given by the specialist before, I would suggest that you have Shiloh seen by someone else who may be more familiar with treating IVDD. With larger dogs, there are other diseases that mimic IVDD. However, it was confirmed through MRI that Shiloh does have IVDD so if there's any suspicion that he's having another disc problem, he should be treated for a disc problem, immediately crated and examined to prevent further spinal damage. Please start reading about IVDD at the link Pauliana gave you above - www.dodgerslist.com/healingindex.htm - so that you are armed with the knowledge that you'll need to fight this disease. You need to have a good understanding of this disease so you know what to expect and what to advocate for with Shiloh's vets. |
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Shiloh's toe nails have worn down to the quick so after talking with the vet I have gotten him neoprene boots to wear on our walks.
