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Post by RustysMom on Sept 15, 2013 3:49:48 GMT -7
Hi- As you probably already have figured out, my boy's name is Rusty. He is a doxy/Jack Russell terrier mix. He is 10 years old. He had a disc injury issue about a year ago, which he recovered quite well from with meds. But he had another episode 2 days ago which resulted in the need for emergency surgery 10 hours ago. . It is 3:30 Am, I can't sleep, so got up and came online to try and do some research in order to prepare for what is ahead.
I was VERY happy to find this forum! I hope to glean as much information from everyone's experience as I can... So here is what I can tell you so far. it is still early, but I am hopeful, and the surgeon is giving me the impression that she is also. Pre surgery, Rus had no use of his back legs ( SO terrifying!) I believe the diagnosis is HansenType I disc disease. But, the Dr said that he had feeling in both feet and legs and was responsive to lighter pain perception,( as apposed to responding only to more serious deep pain perception); so I think that is a good thing. He came through surgery well they tell me. She said the area causing the problem was very large, and it was a good thing they went in and took it out when they did. I am still overwhelmed by everything that has come at me these past 24 hrs, so I apologize if I am not doing a great job of explaining them yet. I am sure in the days and weeks ahead I will be learning much more. Thank you in advance for any advice, comments, or just plain words of encouragement and positive thoughts.
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Post by natureluva on Sept 15, 2013 5:43:50 GMT -7
Hello! Welcome to Dodger's List. My name is Lisa, what's yours? I'm sorry to hear that Rusty has been diagnosed with IVDD and required surgery, but I am glad he made it through the surgery and has a good prognosis! The fact that he had deep pain perception before surgery is encouraging. Sometimes after surgery, a dog's neurological status may actually worsen due to post-op swelling, so don't be alarmed if your vet tells you this. Please let us know when you get an update on his neuro functions, such as DPP, bladder control, and leg movement. Keep in mind, each dog recovers at a different rate and to a different degree. Some dogs stand up a week after surgery and others, like my Goosie, require a much longer recovery time. It took him 11 months after his surgery to walk on his own again. But he did it! We follow what the most knowledgeable Board Certified IVDD surgeons recommend for post-op care, and that is six weeks of crate rest. The dog is allowed out for potty breaks and whatever physical therapy is prescribed by the surgeon. Here are two links to help you with crate rest: www.dodgerslist.com/literature/CrateRRP.htm and www.dodgerslist.com/literature/cratesupplies.htm Here is an article on surgery: www.dodgerslist.com/literature/surgery.htm And here is a list of discharge questions to bring with you when Rusty is discharged: www.dodgerslist.com/literature/dischargequestions.htm If you visit him while he's in the hospital, bring his favorite treat and a t-shirt that you have worn to put in his crate so that he can have your scent with him. Acupuncture and laser light therapy are excellent complementary treatments for IVDD. They both stimulate the nerves to heal and reduce pain and inflammation, and acupuncture has the additional bonus of inducing a state of well-being. These treatments can begin asap, as long as you can safely transport your dog to and from the appointments (crated). You can ask your vet for a referral to a holistic vet that does acupuncture and laser light therapy, or you can search for one in your area here: www.holisticvetlist.com/ The best way for you to help Rusty is by learning about his disease. Here is a brief tutorial on IVDD: www.dodgerslist.com/literature/IVDDcourse/index.html . If a dvd is more your style, we have an excellent one available for only $3 including shipping. It's great to have on hand to show to family/friends/petsitters so they will know what they can and cannot do with your dog and how they can help: www.dodgerslist.com/store/DVDorder.htm We look forward to hearing more about Rusty! Best wishes, ~Lisa |
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Post by RustysMom on Sept 17, 2013 8:02:17 GMT -7
Thank you for your response--so sorry I am so late to reply. But it has been a very busy few days! But,the good news is, when I went to see Rusty last night, when they brought him into the room, he wagged his tail several times! And when the vet tech set him down on the table, she put him in a standing position, and he was able to stand on all 4 legs for a few moments before sitting down! I cried, it was such a great thing to see him able to do those things! The Dr told me they would keep him a few more days, I forgot to ask where he is as far as bowel and bladder yet; hoping that is coming along also. They had taken him off the heavy duty IV pain meds, so he was acting more like himself. Even barked at people he saw out in the parking lot thru the window....that's the real Rusty, always an opinion about everything!  I look forward to reading all of the info you posted for me. And I am sure I will be sent home with plenty of info on how to handle his recovery too. It's going to be a busy time, but glad I have resources like this page to help Thanks again OH....my name is Pam, by the way! |
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StevieLuv
Helpful Member 
Conservative Treatment 3x. It really does work!
Posts: 1,335 
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Post by StevieLuv on Sept 17, 2013 9:12:24 GMT -7
Hi Pam, my name is Maureen. It was great to hear that Rusty did so well with the surgery. Looking forward to more updates when you get him home |
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Post by natureluva on Sept 17, 2013 12:39:37 GMT -7
Hi Pam, I am thrilled to hear that Rusty already has a return of some neurological function!
When a dog has a disc injury, there is a predictable course of neurological deterioration. When nerve healing occurs, often it follows in the reverse order:
1. Pain
2. Wobbly walking, legs cross
3. Nails scuffing floor
4. Paws knuckle (loss of proprioception)
5. Legs do not work (paralysis, dog is down)
6. Bladder control is lost
7. Tail wagging with joy is lost
8. Deep pain sensation
Therefore, the first neuro function to return would be DPS, the second-tail wagging, the third-bladder control, etc. So since Rusty can wag his tail, bladder control should follow shortly!
We look forward to hearing how things go in the coming days. Best wishes, ~Lisa
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Post by RustysMom on Sept 18, 2013 13:55:35 GMT -7
Well, it sounds like he is right on course then-- when the Dr called this AM, she said he is now urinating on his own! SO glad to hear that... She said he is ready to come home today also, so I will be picking him up in a couple hours. You guys are great, I am so glad I found this forum! I am sure in the weeks ahead, I wil be needing lots of tips, pointers, and words of wisdom from all of you! I will keep you posted as things progress; but so far, it seems very hopeful. The condition he was in on Saturday morning, I wasn't even sure that I would still have my boy by the end of the day...but now it is looking much brighter
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Post by natureluva on Sept 18, 2013 15:13:27 GMT -7
Sounds like Rusty is going to be just fine! From what you've described, he's already had a wonderful result from surgery. While he is on crate rest, you can start safeguarding your home for the IVDD dog: www.dodgerslist.com/literature/protectback.htm We look forward to hearing your next update! Best wishes, ~Lisa |
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Post by RustysMom on Sept 20, 2013 10:26:29 GMT -7
Thanks for the info, I will for sure look at it. Well, I think the Rusmeister is progressing on schedule pretty well. He is doing a bit of wobbly walking now. And the surgeon said his confinement can be one of those larger exercise pens,not just the crate. So we have one on the way! I walk him outside using a figure 8 type rear leg harness they sent us home with. He isn't thrilled with it, but we manage. I do massage and exercises with him twice a day, and he will be starting laser therapy on Monday. So....I think things are on a good course!
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Marjorie
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Member since 2011. Surgery & Conservative
Posts: 5,724
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Post by Marjorie on Sept 20, 2013 10:47:02 GMT -7
Wobbly walking, too - how wonderful! Rusty is certainly coming along just grand. Kudos on doing the exercises and getting laser therapy for Rusty. I did want to point out one thing to you. It concerns me that you said "larger" exercise pen. While an exercise pen can certainly be used instead of a crate, it should only be big enough for Rusty to stand up, turn around and lie down with his legs extended. Otherwise, he can move around too much in a larger area and you don't want him to have any setbacks.
Thoughts and prayers for continued improvement.
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Post by RustysMom on Sept 20, 2013 14:47:11 GMT -7
Well, I will double check with them again, but I was actually surprised at her saying the exercise pen was ok also. But she said it was, as long as there was nothing in the area that he could jump or climb on. I will check and make sure, in case I misunderstood and she was talking about after his initial crate rest time. But she mentioned it in the whole teaching/info session they have with you on discharge, and it seems like she was saying it was ok now...but I willl check. He is doing so well, I don't want any setbacks.
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StevieLuv
Helpful Member
Conservative Treatment 3x. It really does work!
Posts: 1,335
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Post by StevieLuv on Sept 20, 2013 16:40:15 GMT -7
Here is a link to the site with the information on surgery and crate rest afterwards dodgerslist.com/literature/surgery.htmI would strongly recommend that you avoid the expen - too much movement can be catastrophic - better safe (in a crate or recovery suite) than sorry. I am so happy that Rusty is doing so well |
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Post by RustysMom on Sept 21, 2013 8:54:32 GMT -7
OK, thanks. I am supposed to call them with an update today, and I will ask again about the person who discharged us saying a 6x6 exercise pen was ok. In fact, I just remembered...she even said that if I had an empty room with no furniture in it, he could even be in there....he just needed to be somewhere with nothing he could jump or climb on. Very weird....because I had heard the same things you are saying. So, I will get another opinion for sure, and will for now at least keep him in the small crate.
BTW, he is definitely getting normal feeling back....he awoke me at 4 Am because he need to go outside and have a bowel movement and empty his bladder. And when I was doing his exercises and massage last night-- he usually has really sensitive feet that he doesn't like me to mess with; and since all of this, he doesn't seem to notice me tickling and playing with his feet. But last night when I was working with them, he did one of his normal twitch and jerked his foot away from me...so I know he felt what I was doing in between his toes!
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StevieLuv
Helpful Member
Conservative Treatment 3x. It really does work!
Posts: 1,335
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Post by StevieLuv on Sept 21, 2013 9:35:24 GMT -7
AAgggghhhh! "an empty room would be okay" Aaaaaggggghhhh! But very good news on the feeling in his feet! |
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Post by RustysMom on Sept 21, 2013 21:05:24 GMT -7
OK, I talked to them again today, and they are saying that no, I probably should not give him that much space just yet. So I am not sure what she meant when she said a 6x6 exercise pen...The wire crate that is just big enough for him to stretch out and turn around is best. But, a small bathroom would be okay.... I don't know about that; I don't like locking my dog in an enclose bathroom anyway, so for now the crate it is. He is progressing too well to take any chances, that's for sure.
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StevieLuv
Helpful Member
Conservative Treatment 3x. It really does work!
Posts: 1,335
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Post by StevieLuv on Sept 22, 2013 10:46:18 GMT -7
I am so glad that they clarified that for you. Good job on asking those questions and demanding clarification from your Vet. The crate sounds like the perfect size for Rusty, and this time will go by faster than you will expect. Give your little sweetie a rub behind the ears from me |
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Post by RustysMom on Sept 22, 2013 21:24:53 GMT -7
He used his right back leg to scratch his ear this afternoon....that seems like a huge milestone, being able to have that kind of motor skill, feeling and control! He was before this, and still is a fit, strong little guy; his vet said at his last check-up that he is in exceptional health for 10 yrs old. I am hoping it helps make his recovery go easier for him.
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Marjorie
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Member since 2011. Surgery & Conservative
Posts: 5,724
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Post by Marjorie on Sept 23, 2013 6:19:32 GMT -7
That IS a huge milestone, Pam! Wonderful news. Keep it going there, little Rusty - you're doing great. |
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Post by RustysMom on Sept 23, 2013 7:57:31 GMT -7
I think so! It really does seem he is improving at a good pace. Especially when I read how long it takes for some dogs. His ear scratching wasn't as robust as he wanted it to be and he was a little frustrated, but he keeps trying now and then. He is definitely regaining awareness and sensation in his rear legs that was missing a week ago. I am feeling very happy about it. I am supposed to begin laser treatments today, if I can get out of work early enough to get him there. If not today, tomorrow for sure
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StevieLuv
Helpful Member
Conservative Treatment 3x. It really does work!
Posts: 1,335
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Post by StevieLuv on Sept 23, 2013 10:29:27 GMT -7
That is WONDERFUL progress!!! |
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Post by RustysMom on Sept 24, 2013 7:48:53 GMT -7
We did the first of six laser therapy treatments last night. Poor guy was shaking and afraid when we went into the vet's office, after all he has been through! Hopefully with each one he will settle down and realize heisn't going to get left, or go thru what he went thru with the surgery.
A question--- ways to relieve boredom in the crate.....Poor guy is getting depressed at being in that cage 24/7. I take him outside for potty breaks, but other than that and during massage and exercises, he is in there. Plus I have to go to work every day, coming home at lunch and in the evening. So he spends that time in their also. I think it would help if I can figure out a safe, secure way to put his cage up in a window so he can watch the goings on in the street outside. That is his favorite thing to do most days anyway. Anyone have any other good ideas to entertain a crated dog? I do leave the TV on to make some sound while I am working
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Marjorie
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Member since 2011. Surgery & Conservative
Posts: 5,724
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Post by Marjorie on Sept 25, 2013 10:27:36 GMT -7
Actually it's best if they are bored because when they're bored, they usually just go to sleep and it's rest that's most needed. Does he sometimes get excitable if something's happening outside and he can see it? If so, it would be best to keep him away from the window when you're not there to calm him down, though that would be nice if you're there to supervise. The time will pass. Poor boy, getting upset about going to the vet's again. I know my Jeremy got to the point where he was most content in the crate where he felt the safest, with all the therapy and acupuncture happening whenever he came out!
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Post by RustysMom on Sept 26, 2013 9:04:15 GMT -7
Maybe you are right--being bored is better than being excited. But it just isn't his nature, so it's hard to see him look so sad! He is a fiesty little guy; being half doxy and half JRT, he really can't help it. I have been putting his crate in the window so he can see the neighborhood whenever I am at my computer in the evening, since it is right next to where I am sitting so I can monitor him. He does get excited in that he barks and "yells" at the kids, other dogs, "suspicious looking characters" :-) It's just what he lives for, so I hate to take that away from him. He is on codiene every 8 hrs, and that helps him sleep part of the time, but he will be finished with that soon, so I am afraid his boredom will get worse.
We did session 2 of laser therapy last night, he was less fearful this time thank goodness. Still shaking some, but not nearly as bad as the first trip there for it. I am looking into starting him on water therapy soon, once the Dr ok's it. I am looking at acupuncture also, I hear good things about that.
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Marjorie
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Member since 2011. Surgery & Conservative
Posts: 5,724
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Post by Marjorie on Sept 26, 2013 10:22:52 GMT -7
It is VERY hard to see our "babies" miss out on things they love! My Jeremy is an active dog and his favorite thing is taking long hikes and running on the beach. He had 6 weeks of crate rest after his surgery and then another 8 weeks recently for a second disc episode that was treated conservatively. He missed a whole summer's worth of beach time. That on top of the 6 months he spent in a cage at a shelter before I adopted him. Twice a week I pick up work at my office (I work at home) and he always comes with me and we take a walk around a lake near there. A very excited walk - yipe, yipe, ducks! yipe, yipe, jump in the lake! yipe, yipe, they're getting away! Every time I walked out of the house with my briefcase and he knew I was going without him, the look on his face just broke my heart. But he's back to all of that now so it was all well worth it.
I'm glad to see that you're looking at acupuncture, too. When Jeremy was first startig to make very slow, gradual progress, I saw the most improvements after his acupuncture sessions. I hope it's as helpful for Rusty as it was for Jeremy.
All the best to you and Rusty.
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Post by RustysMom on Sept 27, 2013 21:22:59 GMT -7
I will for sure look into the acupuncture-- In fact, Rusty's surgeon is also a trained acupuncturist too, so when he goes in for his check up next Wednesday, we will be talking about it. He had session 3 of the laser therapy today, and I am really seeing improvement in his strength and control of his rear legs. He is raring to go though, so the next couple of weeks will be tough to keep him quite.
He will run out of codeine on Sunday, so I am going to have to figure out if he will do okay without any pain meds or not. Will 2 weeks be long enough after surgery to stop pain meds? I don't want to put drugs in him any longer than necessary, but I also don't want him to have pain. I guess I will be able to tell if he is having trouble, and they said if he needs more they will refill it for him. Also I am wondering if I should taper him off rather than just making him go cold turkey on Sunday? He was on them every 8 hrs, but I have been stretching it out to 10 hrs now to see if he can gradually go off of them.
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Marjorie
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Member since 2011. Surgery & Conservative
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Post by Marjorie on Sept 28, 2013 6:22:51 GMT -7
Hi, Pam. Signs of pain to keep an eye out for are shivering/trembling, not wanting to move much or moving gingerly, yelping, tight/tense stomach muscles, just not their usual perky-interested-in-life self. I think a taper would be a good idea, but you should run that past your vet first. Can they be contacted if he does have pain on Sunday or would you have to wait until Monday to reach them? You might want to run this by them before they do close for the weekend to see what they suggest. I hope Rusty does well getting off the codeine. Let us know how it goes.
All the best to you.
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Post by Nancy & Polly on Sept 28, 2013 10:06:59 GMT -7
Our surgeon suggested to us that since IVDD is a chronic problem, we should always have pain meds on hand in case of recurrence. Bad things seem to have a way of happening on weekends, or late at night when getting to your vet is difficult or impossible. Ask for a refill just in case. Hopefully, you'll never need to open the bottle, but it's a comfort to know its there.
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Post by RustysMom on Sept 28, 2013 14:18:33 GMT -7
Does anyone have an opinion as to codeine vs tramadol for pain? The first emergency vet I took Rus to 2 weeks ago sent me off to the specialty clinic with tramadol and muscle relaxants. But the specialty clinic where they did his surgery said I wouldn't need those, that they only use codeine. So, I WILL have something for pain in case of an emergency, but it will be tramadol rather than the codeine he has been taking. I am just wondering why this clinic doesn't use tramadol, when both my regular vet and the ER I went to first both gave me that for pain. Also, I called today and they told me I could get another script of codeine tomorrow if I think he needs it, so I won't be stuck without it if necessary.
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Post by Nancy & Polly on Sept 28, 2013 16:11:42 GMT -7
Our neurosurgeon prefers codeine, although there are studies out there showing its not the best. There are so many opinions out there...it's hard to know.
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Post by Crystal & Abby on Oct 2, 2013 7:35:01 GMT -7
Hi Pam this is Crystal, Abby's mom, I'm kind of in the same boat, I have one codeine pill left from her post op meds and a whole bottle of Tramadol from before surgery. I'll ask the vet, but I thought about just switching back to the Tramadol for now. I also only have another day or so of anti-inflammatory left, and she's been on it for 2.5 weeks now so I need to ask if we will need to continue that as well. I did start some Pepcid for her tummy.
Abby took a few very wobbly cross legged steps with those back legs this morning! I was very happy to see that! She is 9 days post op. She will have her second acupuncture treatment and another laser light treatment at the vet this afternoon.
Glad things are going well for Rusty!
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Post by RustysMom on Oct 3, 2013 8:30:56 GMT -7
Well, Rusty had his follow up appt with his surgeon last night. He passed with flying colors! She said she is very happy at his progress. He had his stiches removed, and she said it has healed up beautifully. Also, she said he can start swim therapy now; so on the way home we stopped by Splash Dogs, and watched another dog doing his therapy, and talked to them about getting Rus set up for it soon. Oh, and the Dr also said Rus could be in the larger exercise pen for periods when I am there to watch him, but to keep him still pretty confined to crate rest for another week. His independent walking is still pretty wobbly, so I don't think I want him doing too much yet. We will get the swim therapy going soon, I think that will help a lot. He needs it to burn off some energy too, he is tired of being confined. He saw a squirrel in the yard yesterday and wanted to take off running after it!...it is going to be a challenge to keep him settled down for another few weeks...
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