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Post by Michelle & Winter on Aug 14, 2021 23:34:24 GMT -7
[Original subject line: Conservative care 4 days in ]
Hi guys This is such a wonderful group. I’m new here and after some advice please. I’m so stressed, heartbroken and haven’t slept for 4 nights.
My beloved 10 year old bichon (winter) was diagnosed Thursday [8/12] night with IVDD, total back leg paralysis. She is not a candidate for surgery as she has Cushing disease. The vet of course said to euthanasia her. I of course refused and brought her home. She is currently on gabepentin.
Since she is home she has started to eat a little and drink water. However she refuses to get up. She just lays there on her side all day with no fight in her.
We have been taking her out for toilet, turning her over every few hours.
THIS CONCERNS ME - She refuses to try and use her front paws and as I say just lies there.
Is this normal? Or is this typical after the first few days, I mean am I expecting to much. She has been through an ordeal.
Please can anyone give me any hope, advice or similar experiences. I feel so lost, scared, tired and hopeless
Thank you ❤️
☆ 1 Unknown weight, but a little overweight she is on gabeptin every 12 hours. Started 2 days ago Other meds - Veteryol for Cushing disease
[MED LIST/HISTORY- Moderator's Note. Please do not edit ] weight? 10 y.o. crate rest started Aug 12? or no anti-inflammatory Rx'd? gabapentin ?mgs 2x/day Veteryol for Cushings needs GI tract protector, Pepcid AC, on board with any anti-inflammatory When off all meds and no pain, then LIGHT ROM can begin for paralyzed leg ]
☆ 2 My name is Michelle. Dogs name is winter she is a 10 year old bichon I am from the UK
☆ 3 Diagnosis - IVDD was diagnosed (4 days ago) saw the vet last Thursday [AUG 12] morning 4 am. total back leg paralysis. They will not offer surgery as she has Cushing disease total back leg paralysis. generic vet centres. No specialist ☆ 5 She is not as in as much pain as she was previously. However she refuses to move and just lies there (mostly sleeping) slight pain but not as much as previously. Yelps a lot but think this is frustration along with her telling me she wants something
☆ 6 total back leg paralysis. She refuses to get up. No wagging of tail. Winters movement - total back lag paralysis. She just lies there and refuses to move at all (we are 4 days post diagnosis) this really concerns me. She does not wag tail or anything
☆ 7 Toilet - needs assistance but going for both. Slightly constipated and I think this is hurting her. we take her out. She refuses to put any weight down
☆ 8 She is still drinking same amount of water and will tell when she wants some. She is eating but not as much as she normally does. Her poop is not as frequent as normal. But it’s soft[??] I feel she is constipated[??]
8/16 UPDATED INFO from FB [on Behalf of Michelle, FB post moved to the FORUM 8/16:]
I have her booked in tomorrow [8/16] with vet (well over phone) to ask for more meds based upon your site. She is only on gabepentin and it seems she needs anti inflammatories and alike.
She doesn’t seem in pain. She seems so fed up and miserable (of course she will be) She is eating and drinking Bladder - she does bark to go have toilet (both) and has done outside, although she has had some in her bed too.
Just spoke with the vet [8/16 a.m.]. As winter my fur baby has Cushing disease and is taking veteroyl, the vets have refused to prescribe her prednisone and also refused to offer any alternative?
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PaulaM
Moderator.
Member since 2007: surgery, conservative . Montana, USA
Posts: 19,493
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Post by PaulaM on Aug 15, 2021 8:00:30 GMT -7
Michelle, you have an emergency of pain to deal with right away, today, this Sunday Aug 15. It may mean going to ER if your vet is closed on Sunday. There is no reason for Winter to be suffering with pain. The pain meds clearly were not properly perscribed for Winter. It can take several adjustments to get it right. Vet needs your feedback to know to fix the meds. NECK DISC, not moving front legs indicates this is very likely a NECK DISC. Were did the vet tell you the disc was located? There are extra things you can do at home to help the neck heal, such as softening hard kibble, raising food/water dishes, etc. It won't hurt even if the disc is in the back. More info here: dodgerslist.com/2020/05/05/cervical-care-tips/No need to reinvent the wheel with at home nursing care during a disc episode: dodgerslist.com/nursing-care-during-the-disc-episode ◽️Lots of member tips ◽️Useful supplies ◽️Review on bladder expressing ◽️Cervical (neck) disc care and more. Typically the meds when proerly Rx'd will provide full comfort from pain in one hour. This is the typical combo of meds used with a disc episode. Your vet will explain if some can't be used due to cushings. 1) Resolution of spinal cord inflammation/swelling provides the relief from pain. It can take an anti-inflammatory (steroid or a non-steriodal NSAID) a range of 7 to 30 days before all swelling is gone. Advocate for an anti-inflammatory drug. 2) The best pain medications control is using more than one approach to address pain from multiple fronts Advocate for traMADol-general analgesic, methocarbamol- muscle spasm pain, gabapentin-nerve pain every 8 hrs.). All three pain meds last in the body for about 8 hrs. Therefore look for the vet to prescribe these three meds every 8 hrs (3x/day).
3) Advocate for a stomach protector to suppress acid production such as prescription Pepcid AC (Famotidine) to protect against the side effects of the anti-inflammatory. RED FLAG signs are soft stool, not eating well, vomit, bleeding ulcers, black or red blood in diarrhea
Adjusting meds by phone avoids a risky-to-the disc car transport. Describe the pain that you're seeing over the phone. A vet who has examined Winter or another vet in the clinic also has access to Winter's file and they CAN prescribe over the phone.
PUMPKIN IT is not clear if you are reporting constipation with the use of both "soft" and the use of "constipated" describing poop. PLEASE let us know if she is showing red flag signs of SOFT STOOL. Plain pureed canned pumpkin is a magical fruit - its high fiber can firm up stools and help with diarrhea or loosen the stool to help with constipation. NOTE: alternatives are really ripe mashed fresh pear, just take off the peel off; microwaved and mashed peeled sweet potato, --To loosen the constipated stool, add equal parts water to each kibble meal and soak overnight. At mealtime add one teaspoon of plain canned pureed pumpkin 1x a day. Give a teaspoon (4.93mL) of pumpkin for every 10 pounds (4.54 kg) of body weight, TOILET It is a health issue to know for certain if Winter still has bladder control. If she does not, then today you need to get hands-on-top-of-your-hands type of expressing lesson. First reading and viewing the video at this page: dodgerslist.com/2020/05/05/bladder-bowel-care/ will help you to learn expressing faster -- NO BLADDER CONTROL means you find urine leaks in bedding or she leaks on you when lifted. She will need to have her bladder manually expressed by you. -- BLADDER CONTROL means she can sniff an old pee spot and decide to release urine there Let us know if she has bladder control or not
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PaulaM
Moderator.
Member since 2007: surgery, conservative . Montana, USA
Posts: 19,493
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Post by PaulaM on Aug 16, 2021 7:45:23 GMT -7
Just happened to see your 8/16 post on Facebook messages. Adding this in addition to my post above: Michelle when you spoke with vet over the phone 8/16 a.m., Did you specifically ask for -- Metacam, a non-steroid anti-inflammatory drug (NSAID)? Metacam is so very often used in the UK rather than the steroid prednisone? -- did you ask for traMADol and methocarbamol to be added to the gabapentin IF, if this am you are seeing any signs of pain:SIGNS OF PAIN: ⚙︎ shivering-trembling ⚙︎ yelping when picked up or moved ⚙︎ tight tense tummy ⚙︎ arched back, ears pinned bac ⚙︎ restless, can't find a comfortable position ⚙︎ slow or reluctant to move in suite such as shift positions ⚙︎ not their normal perky interested in life selves ➕ if a neck disc: not able or not wanting to move front legs sounds like Winter has a NECK DISC. What dit the vet say?◻︎ head held high/ nose to the ground ◻︎ looks up with just eyes and does not move head and neck easily. ◻︎ not eating due to painful chewing or in too much overall pain ◻︎ holds front or back leg up flamingo style not wanting to bear weight Please bookmark Winters thread here on the FORUM so you can easily comeback and keep us updated. dodgerslist.boards.net/thread/8160/michelles-winter-conserv-cushings-bichon
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