Suzy's Lovie 10/18 conservative NECK Yorkie/Poo GRAD 12/13

Welcome Suzy!  Good news on no signs of pain round the clock and and nerve improvement to be able make an attempt to move up into a stand with the front legs (Is that correct?)  Or he can just move the front legs but not yet get in to a stand position by himself.

Oh, and another thing, he did not have a surgery? Your Neuro vet is treating instead with medications, strict rest and time to heal the disc?

Which do you actually give these two meds every 8hrs OR every 12 hrs?:  gabapentin and trazodone

Post surgical rest is often for 4-6 weeks, because the offending disc material was surgically removed and save activity can restart sooner.

With noted neuro damage to Lovie's front legs, that's a concern to get the disc to heal preventing more serious front leg damage when under conservative treatment. Ask and discuss what harm there would be to give Lovie's neck disc full opportunity to heal and form secure scar tissue.  Would there be harm in doing 8 weeks of STRICT rest of limited movement?  Your neuro knows Lovie's situation best, so let us know what he thinks in Lovie's particular case.

So in general, since early days of 2002 these Dodgerslist observations (mind you, not a high quality scientific study with randomized, controlled, blinded and adequate control group) give dogs best chance of not falling back in disc healing, no retears to the disc.
    The hallmark component of conservative treatment is the very STRICT crate rest part (no PT, little movement). With little blood supply discs are much slower to form good scar tissue than it takes a blood rich broken bone to heal. Those weeks of a cast for a broken arm to heal is similar to the recovery suite being a kind of cast for the disc. 100% STRICT rest 24/7 for 8 weeks provides limited movement to allow good strong scar tissue to form.

▶︎ Super tried and true tips for setting up the recovery suite, the mattress and more! dodgerslist.com/2020/05/14/strict-rest-recovery-process/

Knowledge is key!
Owner understanding ensures proper conservaitve treatment principals:
▶︎ 4 phases of healing, what it takes to heal each phase: dodgerslist.com/healing-the-disc/
▶︎ Roadmap for your fridge. Stay the course, avoid dangerous detours for the healing disc: dodgerslist.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/07/Roadmap-for-Fridge.pdf

STRICT rest means:
◼︎no laps   ◼︎no couches   ◼︎no baths    ◼︎no sleeping with you    ◼︎no chiro therapy WHYs: dodgerslist.com/2020/04/22/chiropractic/ ◼︎no dragging or meandering at potty times. ◼︎no PT for conservative dogs during 8 weeks to heal disc. ◼︎ Food and water bowls in the suite   ◼︎ Only out of the suite for potty time    

◼︎At home laser or acupuncture for severe neuro damage is best.
     Transports are always a risk to the disc of too much movement. Vet visits must be weighed risk vs. benefit for dogs with little to mild neuro diminishment.

POTTY TIME strictness
Carry your dog to and from the recovery suite to the potty place and then allow a very, very few limited footsteps.
    Using a sling (long winter scarf, ace bandage, belt) will save your back and help to keep a wobbly dog's back aligned and butt from tipping over. A harness and 6 foot leash is to control speed and keep footsteps to minimum as you stand in one spot. An ex-pen in the grass is an excellent alternative to minimizing footsteps with the physical and visual to indicate there will be no sniff festing going on!

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For front leg weakness use a front end sling for sure. Use a back end sling also if back legs  need some support to prevent a fall.

Extras you can do at home to help with a neck disc: dodgerslist.com/2020/05/05/cervical-care-tips/

DIY Slings that can be used for front legs:
A sling is used as back up to catch a wobbly dog's butt and prevent twisting the back. Any sling needs to be accompanied by a front harness and leash to control speed to the very slow minimal footsteps at potty time especially during conservative treatment or the post-op crate rest period.

1) DIY sweatshirt sling...can be used for front or the back legs. Use same concept with cut out leg holes in a long strip of towel: www.lyonpuffpetsit.com/htmlslp/sling.html

2) DIY  figure 8 DIY sling works especially well for the male dog anatomy at potty times. 

EMAIL ALERTS
Please do set up email alerts when anyone has replied. Timely interaction/communications is needed when helping your dog. How to set up: dodgerslist.boards.net/thread/7353/register-bookmark-dogs-post-thread

Suzy, he may sit up on his butt or stand up on all four legs, that is ok. Just no rambunctious activity in his suite. Very good news on nerve healing.


Which do you actually give these two meds every 8hrs OR every 12 hrs?: gabapentin and trazodone

Thanks for the clarification, Suzy. Gabapentin only stays in the body for about 8 hours so if you see any sign of pain arising between doses, do give Gabapentin every 8 hours (3x/day). Neck injuries are usually more painful than back injuries and can take longer to heal. Tramadol as a general pain med and/or Methocarbamol for the pain of muscles spasms that often accompany neck injuries can also be added to keep pain completely under control.

Signs of pain to be on the lookout for:
◻︎ restless, pacing, can’t find a comfortable position
◻︎reluctant to move much in crate such as shift positions
◻︎shivering-trembling ◻︎yelping when picked up or moved
◻︎slow to move ◻︎tight tense tummy
◻︎arched back, ears pinned back ◻︎ head held high or nose to the ground.
◻︎looks up with just eyes and does not move head and neck easily.
◻︎ not eating due to pain of moving jaw with a neck disc or pain of back disc
◻︎ holds front or back leg flamingo style not wanting to bear weight
◻︎not their normal perky selves

Anytime a dog is taking an anti-inflammatory, stomach protection must be added. Ask if your dog has any health issues to prevent use of Pepcid AC (famotidine)? (doesn’t need it, we wait til there is problem…are NOT answers to your question!) If you get a “no health” issues answer, then go to the grocery store to purchase over the counter Pepcid AC containing one single active ingredient (famotidine). i.ibb.co/DCN9611/91x-Aj-s00z-L-SY355.jpg
Doxie weight dogs: 5mg Pepcid AC (famotidine) every 12 hours. NOTE: Pepcid AC (famotidine) for dogs is 0.44mg per pound, 30 mins before the anti-inflammatory and thereafter every 12 hours for as long as your dog is on the anti-inflammatory. www.1800petmeds.com/Famotidine-prod11171.html

Prednisone causes increased thirst/urination so while on that med, you may need to carry Lovie out to potty more often to prevent accidents in his recovery suite. While on Prednisone, we often see the necessity to potty every 2-3 hours.

Healing prayers for Lovie.

Suzy do you have Pepcid AC (famtodine) on board for the duration of Prednisone?

100% very STRICT rest is how a disc self heals. Too much movement at potty time is how an early healing disc can re-tear. Back at square one, dog in pain, and potential for severe nerves damage for legs. Stay the course with 100% STRICT limited movement/rest so that the disc can heal.


A consult with a neuro can be for not just a surgery, but when a local vet is not able to get the pain down.

I'm wondering why you would risk a vehicle transport into a neuro appt when:
--- Lovie is self healing his nerves to be able to walk with the front legs even if wobbly and needing a font sling.  
--- When the current meds are covering any pain as Rx'd by your vet.
--- NOTE on Nov 1 will be the Prednisone taper test for pain. Who knows maybe that test will show there is no need for meds other than to finish out the pred taper.
--- There is no surgical procedure that can heal nerves. As mentioned nerves heal on their own.

Could you tell what your expectation is for a December Neuro appt?