Ro & Jack
New Member
MALE - Frenchie
Posts: 2
|
Post by Ro & Jack on Jan 31, 2020 17:49:18 GMT -7
[Original subject line:New to Dodgerslist ]
L1 pain?
X can’t find a comfortable position, appears restless
☆ 2 My dog weights 24 pounds.
A.. Caprofen 25mg, one tablet every 24 hours
Gabapentin 100mg, one tablet every 8-12 hours
[Moderator's Note. Please do not edit
24 lbs
carprofen as of 1/30: 25mgs 1x/day for 14 days then 2/13 test stop for: _pain / _neuro
gabapentin 100 mgs 3x/day
needs GI tract protector, Pepcid AC, on board w/ carprofen! ]
☆ 3 -- Eating and drinking OK? No nausea/not eating, no vomit? Yes
He has lost the ability to pee and poop normally. We are expressing him. He is pooping but it is just coming out not when we take him outside or when it’s his normal schedule. Poop is normal (solid).
☆ 4 What breed? French Bull Dog What is your dog’s name? Jack Your name, too? Ro
☆ 5 Yes, slipped disk
-- Is the vet a general DVM? General DVM
☆ 6 Saw the vet for CONSERVATIVE treatment? January 30, 2020
☆ 7 He has loss bladder control.
☆ 8 My dog cannot walk. No tail movement
|
|
PaulaM
Moderator. 
Member since 2007: surgery, conservative . Montana, USA
Posts: 19,541
|
Post by PaulaM on Jan 31, 2020 19:38:24 GMT -7
Ro, welcome to the Forum! I appears you have checked that Jack is suffering with pain. The reason for that is he is WAY way under medicated for pain with only one pain med on board. This really need quick attention.... not fair to leave him in pain if possible to get attention for him at ER? Make sure you ARE giving gabapentin promptly every 8 hrs. Let us know you have been or if you are just starting every 8 tonight.
Advocate for a combo of pain meds to be given 3x/day (every 8 hours) promptly. —Methocarbamol works on the pain of muscle spasms. — Tramadol is the general pain reliever. √ Gabapentin works on nerve pain. Give 100mg every 8 hrs. is a good Rx. There should be no sign of pain from one dose of meds to the next. Have no patience with pain as it does hinder healing. Look for your dog to be acting their normal, perky self when pain is fully under control round the clock. Always keep your vet informed when pain is not being controlled. Was this pain happening yesterday after the exam? Did the pain just surface today? Did Jack get any shots at the vet yesterday that would help us further understand why: can’t find a comfortable position, appears restless ? Ro, was Jack not walking yesterday at the vet visit?
Or did loss of legs happen today (1/31)?Does Jack stay dry expressing session to session? How many times a day or every ? hrs do you express? How to express for poop and tips. Very simply, not like bladder expressing, you will not need a lesson. LINK to poop expressing: www.dodgerslist.com/literature/Expressing.htmPEPCID ACAsk if your dog has any health issues to prevent use of Pepcid AC (famotidine)? (doesn’t need it, we wait til there is problem…are NOT answers to your question!) If you get a confirmed “no health” issues answer, then go to the grocery store to purchase over the counter Pepcid AC containing one single active ingredient (famotidine). The usual dose of Pepcid AC (famotidine) with a disc episode is 0.44mg mg per pound every 12 hours. Jack 24lbs X 0.44mgs famotidine = 10mgs every 12 hours. HEALTH ISSUES: “Mar Vista Vet reports: Pepcid AC has a very limited potential for side effects, the reason of release to over-the-counter status. The dose of famotidine may require reduction in patients with liver or kidney disease as these diseases tend to prolong drug activities. There have been some reports of exacerbating heart rhythm problems in patients who already have heart rhythm problems so it may be prudent to choose another means of stomach acid control in heart patients.” marvistavet.com/famotidine.pml
|
|
Ro & Jack
New Member
MALE - Frenchie
Posts: 2
|
Post by Ro & Jack on Feb 1, 2020 8:04:57 GMT -7
This post will be merged to Jack thread on the CONSERVATIVE BOARD here: dodgerslist.boards.net/thread/7298/ros-jack-30-conservative-bulldog Please bookmark this link. Thanks. [Original subject line: Reply to your questions regard Jack] Jack started his medications at 5:00am on 1/30/20. The Carprofen prescription is 14 tablets. The Gabapentin is taken every 8 hours and the prescription is for 21 tablets. We are consistent on giving him his meds promptly at the correct time. He is comfortable today....no signs of pain. I think the problem is he doesn’t like being caged. Jack was not walking at the time of his vet visit on 1/30/20. That was the first day he showed paralysis. Jack stays dry (no urine). I express 4 times a day. Additionally, on 1/30/20 had a laser and acupuncture treatment. He is schedule for another laser and acupuncture treatment at 8:30am this morning. |
|
PaulaM
Moderator.
Member since 2007: surgery, conservative . Montana, USA
Posts: 19,541
|
Post by PaulaM on Feb 1, 2020 9:44:22 GMT -7
Ro, with your appt today discuss using a calmer with your vet to help Jack be able to relax in his crate and Pepcid AC to protect against the acids carprofen causes. Using any oral calmer in combination with a Pheromone diffuser seems to work best. It takes several days for these to start working - it isn't immediate but they are a much better option if you can avoid heavy duty prescription sedatives (ACE, alprazolam or trazodone). Of course always keep your vet in the loop on all things you give your dog. Place a DAP pheromone diffusor at floor level where the recovery suite is: --DOG Adaptil (DAP) wall plug in diffuser 48ml www.adaptil.com/Use diffusor with one oral calmer from below:Oral calmers: 1) ANXITANE® S chewable tabs contain 50 mg L-Theanine, an amino acid that acts neurologically to help keep dogs calm, relaxed www.virbacvet.com/products/detail/anxitane-l-theanine-chewable-tablets/behavioral-health 2) Composure Soft Chews are colostrum based like calming mother's milk and contain 21 mg of L-Theanine. www.vetriscience.com/composure-soft-dogs-MD-LD.php PEPCID AC Ask if your dog has any health issues to prevent use of Pepcid AC (famotidine)? (doesn’t need it, we wait til there is problem…are NOT answers to your question!) If you get a confirmed “no health” issues answer, then go to the grocery store to purchase over the counter Pepcid AC containing one single active ingredient (famotidine).  |
|
PaulaM
Moderator.
Member since 2007: surgery, conservative . Montana, USA
Posts: 19,541
|
Post by PaulaM on Feb 13, 2020 9:45:35 GMT -7
[moved Ro's post of Feb 12 10a.m EST. to the Forum ]
Yesterday, February 11th and today, February 12th, Jack has been standing on his own. He will stand for approx. 5 seconds then sit down. Our vet is continuing with the laser and acupuncture treatments every two to three days. Last week they said they were cautiously optimistic. He has begun to get feeling back in his toes as well. What does recovery look like? Are there things I should look for? We continue to crate him. Thanks Paula.
|
|
PaulaM
Moderator.
Member since 2007: surgery, conservative . Montana, USA
Posts: 19,541
|
Post by PaulaM on Feb 13, 2020 10:08:41 GMT -7
Ro, you have some good questions. First we will need to have more information surrounding how he got into a stand and about the toe movement. This lets us know what can be reflex and what is brain directed. RESULTS of test for pain stop of carprofen?Can you tell us if now all his meds had been stopped (carprofen and the gabapentin) on Feb 12? And that you see no sign of pain? NEURO FUNCTIONFor us humans to be able to distinguish between reflex and brain directed, we have to see some sort of head level involvement with the tail, with a limb or with release of urine so we know the movement was done with purposeful thinking. --- Sniff (head level nose) then release of urine would be brain directed. --- Hear (head level ear) you doing some happy talk and then tail wags is brain directed. Tail, leg, paw movement during potty time can often be a reflex. --- Itchy sensation at at neck and then tries to scratch would be purposeful movement. Tickling paws, etc can cause reflex leg movements. Let us know how Jack got into a stand. Did he raise up on his back legs all on his own. Did you put him into a stand position? Toe movement. Did Jack move his toes for example when trying to reposition himself in the recovery suite? Did you tickle between the pads and saw toes movement? Did the toes move during potty time? NEURO FUNCTION order of returnWhen nerve healing begins, often it follows a predictable order — the reverse order of the nerve damage. Have you seen a happy tail/butt wriggle yet?1. Deep pain sensation, the first neuro function to return. It is critical indicator for nerves to be able to self heal after surgery or with conservative treatment. Only take the word of a neuro (ACVIM) or ortho (ACVS) for this very tricky to identify neuro function.2. Joyful tail wags (butt wriggles) after specifically seeing you return, some happy talk or getting a treat.3. Bladder control begins to return verified with the "sniff and pee" test.4. Small leg movements. Such as trying to use them to reposition when lying down. Trying to scratch and itch5. Attempting to move up into a stand.6. Wobbly weak walking7. Paws knuckle under less and less8. Stronger more steading walking 9 Ability to walk unassisted and perhaps even runMore info: www.dodgerslist.com/literature/healingnerves.htm100% STRICT crate rest 24/7 only out of crate for expressingSo glad to hear you continue the crate rest with room service of bringing his food and carefully expressing. Even trips to the vet need careful consideration, maybe a vet who does home visits for acupuncture/laser. Limited movement is really the single most important part of the care in getting the disc to heal. Limited movement of the spine protects the healing disc from harm. A disc that has been harmed (re-torn) can then do even more damage to the spinal cord which has the potential to be a permanent thing.BOOKMARKING Jack's thread-- Do bookmark this thread so you can get back here easily. -- Go to the CONSERVATIVE Board: checkmark Jack's thread, then use the ACTIONS button to select "bookmark"  |
|
