McKenzie's Pippa 12/2 conserv. NECK- Mini Poodle

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McKenzie & Pippa
New Member

FEMALE - mini poodle

Posts: 1

McKenzie's Pippa 12/2 conserv. NECK- Mini Poodle Dec 8, 2019 23:59:39 GMT -7 via mobile

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Post by McKenzie & Pippa on Dec 8, 2019 23:59:39 GMT -7

[Original thread: IVDD round 2]

Hi! My dog Pippa was diagnosed with IVDD last February after a trip to the emergency ER because she was hiding under the couch. They did an X-ray and were somehow able to see the calcifications in L4-L5. Sent us home to try the conservative approach for a month with strict kennel rest, pain medication, and steroids. We met with our vet the next day to go over everything. After a month she was maxed out on pain medication and still showing extreme pain but no neurological defects. I made an appointment with a neurologist who confirmed no neuro defects and wanted to continue the treatment course. Pippa was on the max dose of 3 pain medications around the clock and still in a lot of visible pain. I decided to go ahead with the MRI and if surgical intervention was needed, go straight into surgery.

During the MRI they found 2 disc that needed surgical repair, but due to location they couldn’t repair both at once. One in her lower back & one in her neck. They made me choose one. SO TOUGH! I went with the one in her [March 2019] back and surgery was successful. She had a lot of post op complications and developed mega esophaguses for a short bit but thankfully after being readmitted they were able to get that under control. Recovery was tough, but she did eventually recover! I modified my small apartment so there was no way she could jump off of any furniture and got her a harness for walks. I even got her started with behavioral training 4 months ago and she has made tremendous progress! I’ve always been on edge knowing the other disc that needed “surgical repair” is in there. I watch her so carefully and on the rare occasion she does jump off furniture, my heart stops.

I noticed she was showing some random aggression towards my other dog this past week and then one night in bed she was panting. I put both things together and wondered if these could be symptoms of pain. I made an appointment with her vet with extremely high hopes I was over reacting. At the vet while she did compressions, Pippa yelped at the spot the 2nd disc is located. My heart broke.

So now we are back to square one just less than a year later. Using the same pain meds, steroids, and kennel rest just feels crazy. I’m hoping to avoid surgery because last surgery was so traumatic for both of us. Not to mention it totaled over $11k. Getting to the diagnosis, the surgery, and all of her post op complications added up quickly. I’m 22 years old and support myself fully by working full time. So funding another surgery would be extremely hard, but not completely impossible. I’m planning on contacting a local (Houston, TX) vet rehab tomorrow that offers in house acupuncture and laser therapy. I’ve thought about adding CBD, turmeric supplements, and dasuqin supplements as well and I’m planning on emailing our vet asking what her thoughts are. Any advice is welcome!

1- Pippa weighs around 11 pounds. She was 10 before surgery in March, then dropped with post op complications, added a couple lbs when we started training because of all of the treats lol, and at the vet this weekend [date?] weighted 10.6 pounds.
She is currently on
-Prednisone 5mg. 1/2 tablet 2x daily for 7 days, then reduce to 1x a day for 7 days, then 1x every other day until inflammation is gone
-Gabapentin 100mg. Every 12 hours as needed
-Apoquel 5.4mg. 1/2 tablet 2x a day. For allergies
Do I need to ask my vet about adding a stomach protector?

[Moderator's Note. Please do not edit
10.6 lbs
Prednisone as of 12/7ish?: 2.5mgs 2x/day for 7 days, then a test taper to reveal any: _pain / _neuro
gabapentin 100mgs 2x/day
Apoquel for allergies
needs GI tract protector, Pepcid AC, on board w/prednisone! ]

2- Pippa is a miniature poodle. She was 4 when she had surgery in March, but turned 5 this past October. My name is McKenzie.

3- Yes, specifically IVDD diagnoses. Oddly enough they saw it in an X-ray at the emergency vet. “CONCLUSIONS: Chronic intervertebral disc disease definitively at L4-L5 with questionable sites of the caudal thoracic and cranial lumbar spine. Acute exacerbation of this with intervertebral disc protrusion or extrusion and secondary spinal cord and/or nerve root compression or impingement is likely the cause of the patient's clinical signs.” The neurologist we saw after her X-ray diagnosis and after the month of a conservative approach is a DVM, DACVIM.

4- Emergency vet diagnosis- 2/12/2018 (start of strict kennel rest)
Neuro consult- 3/14/2018
Date of surgery- 3/22/2018

5- pain symptoms are non explainable aggression episodes towards other dog in house, one episode of panting in bed, and yelped when vet checked the site of 2nd disc that was seen on MRI in March.

6/7/8- acting, eating, drinking, potty is all completely normal!!!!!

Last Edit: Dec 9, 2019 11:11:48 GMT -7 by McKenzie & Pippa

Marjorie
Moderator~

Member since 2011. Surgery & Conservative

Posts: 5,724

McKenzie's Pippa 12/2 conserv. NECK- Mini Poodle Dec 9, 2019 7:02:00 GMT -7

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Post by Marjorie on Dec 9, 2019 7:02:00 GMT -7

I'm so sorry to hear that Pippa is having another disc episode, McKenzie. It does sound as though she's having a very mild episode this time with only pain as a symptom and no neuro deficits so she should do just fine with 8 weeks of strict crate rest. You caught it early!

It will help us work together with you and avoid offering ideas that could cause harm or lead the discussion in the wrong direction delaying help for your dog — please share a bit more detail with us:

❖1 Is there still currently pain? ☐shivering, trembling ☐yelping when picked up or moved ☐reluctant to move much in crate such as shift positions or slow to move ☐tight tense tummy ☐can’t find a comfortable position ☐Arched back ☐ Holding front or back leg flamingo style not wanting to bear weight ☐head held high or nose to the ground ☐Not their normal perky selves? Full pain relief is expected in 1 hour and stays that way dose to dose. If not in control your vet needs to know asap to adjust meds.

❖2 PEPCID AC: Anytime a dog is taking an anti-inflammatory, stomach protection must be added. Ask if your dog has any health issues to prevent use of Pepcid AC (famotidine)? (doesn’t need it, we wait til there is problem…are NOT answers to your question!) If you get a “no health” issues answer, then go to the grocery store to purchase over the counter Pepcid AC containing one single active ingredient (famotidine). canigivemydog.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/10/can-i-give-my-dog-pepcid-ac-300x300.jpg
Doxie weight dogs: 5mg Pepcid AC (famotidine) every 12 hours. NOTE: Pepcid AC (famotidine) for dogs is 0.44mg per pound, 30 mins before the anti-inflammatory and thereafter every 12 hours for as long as your dog is on the anti-inflammatory. www.1800petmeds.com/Famotidine-prod11171.html

❖3 GI Tract problems? —Eating and drinking OK? No nausea/not eating, no vomit? —Poops OK? Normal firmness & color -no dark black or bright red blood indicating bleeding ulcers? No diarrhea?

❖4 What was the date you saw the vet for CONSERVATIVE treatment of meds and started crate rest - was that December 2, 2019?
Just as a reminder: The hallmark component of conservative treatment is the very STRICT crate rest part (no PT, little movement). With little blood supply discs are much slower to form good scar tissue than it takes a blood rich broken bone to heal. Those weeks of a cast for a broken arm to heal is similar to the recovery suite being a kind of cast for the disc. 100% STRICT crate rest 24/7 for 8 weeks provides limited movement to allow good strong scar tissue to form.
Super tried and true tips for setting up the recovery suite, the mattress and more! —> www.dodgerslist.com/literature/CrateRRP.htm

STRICT means: ◼︎no laps ◼︎no couches ◼︎no baths ◼︎no sleeping with you ◼︎no chiro therapy whys: www.dodgerslist.com/literature/chiropractic.htm ◼︎no dragging or meandering at potty times. ◼︎no PT for conservative dogs during 8 weeks to heal disc ◼︎At home laser or acupuncture for severe neuro damage is best. Transports are always a risk to the disc of too much movement. Vet visits must be weighed risk vs. benefit for dogs with little to mild neuro diminishment.

Carry to and from the recovery suite to the potty place and then allow a very few limited footsteps. Using a sling (long winter scarf, ace bandage, belt) will save your back and help to keep a wobbly dog’s back aligned and butt from tipping over. A harness and 6 foot leash is to control speed and keep footsteps to minimum as you stand in one spot. An ex-pen in the grass is an excellent alternative to minimizing footsteps with the physical and visual to indicate there will be no sniff festing going on! www.dodgerslist.com/literature/slingwalk.jpg LARGE DOGS: If your dog is too big to carry, it is still important that the amount of movement to the potty place be minimized. Try a pee pad right outside the crate. Add caster wheels to a wire crate and wheel down ramp over steps to outside.

Healing prayers for Pippa.

Order free literature for yourself & others: dodgerslist.com/free-literature-2/

Disclaimer:
This information is presented for educational purposes and as a resource for the IVD dog community. The coordinators are not veterinarians or health care professionals. Nothing herein should be interpreted as medical advice and all should contact their pet care professionals for advice. The coordinators are not responsible for the substance and content contained herein and do not advocate any particular product, item or position contained herein.

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McKenzie's Pippa 12/2 conserv. NECK- Mini Poodle

Post by McKenzie & Pippa on Dec 8, 2019 23:59:39 GMT -7

Post by Marjorie on Dec 9, 2019 7:02:00 GMT -7