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Post by Elke & Jake on Mar 14, 2019 10:16:10 GMT -7
Officially diagnosed with IVDD on March 13, 2019. Elke's Jake 3/13 conservative- Heart
It's been 4 1/2 years since Jake's injury. All info from previously is above. I don't know if I should do another post, so I just added to this one. He was doing great until March 12th (his 11th birthday, when I noticed he wasn't quite himself...quiet, hesitant). On March 13th, I noticed he was shaking, limping, and a bit hunchy. I immediately crated him and made an appt at his regular general vet. They officially diagnosed him with IVDD (In 2015, he had an injury walking into a door). He had a blood test which revealed high calcium. He has a heart murmur. His xray showed narrowing discs in both the cervical and directly after his rib cage. He is eating and drinking normally and goes potty normally. He is able to walk. Yesterday his rear leg was a bit draggy and slow to flip back at the vet (where he has nerve damage from 2015). Today, he is walking better with no hunch or limp. He is not shaking and does not seem in pain. Jakey gained some weight since 2015 and weighs 19 pounds now. He is on Science Diet kibble for older dogs. The meds he is taking are: Metacam 20# dose one daily, Methocarbamol 1/2 of 500 mg tablet every 8 hours, Tramadol 1/2 of 50mg tablet. Vet said to keep him inactive/quiet for 2 weeks. [Moderator's Note. Please do not edit 19lbs Metacam as of 3/13: 20# dose 1x/day for ? days, the test stop for pain/neuro issues methocarbamol 250mgs 3x/day tramadol 25mgs 1x/day
no stomach protection on board!]
Last time, Jake was on a steroid. Vet preferred NSAIDS this time. In 2015, I took him to a general vet (different than current one) and then to UCDavis to a neurologist. Side note, my 7 year old dachshund was diagnosed with IVDD in July 2018 days before I left on a mission trip to Europe. I was not able to make a post here for her at that time. She healed from weeks of crate rest and meds while my son cared for her with no nerve damage. I will keep Jake crated at least 2 weeks and keep him on the meds. The vet said they will do a blood test again after 2 weeks. Thanks for any advice. I'm a bit stressed having to deal with this again. Luckily Jake likes his crate and is more mellow than in 2015.
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PaulaM
Moderator.
Member since 2007: surgery, conservative . Montana, USA
Posts: 19,540
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Post by PaulaM on Mar 14, 2019 12:14:17 GMT -7
Elke, sorry to hear another disc episode for Jake. Good to hear you crated at once to prevent further damage of the disc and to keep the mild neuro diminishment (slow to right knuckled paw) from moving to severe. -- For how many days did the vet Rx the Metacam? -- Speak with the vet about some sort of stomach protector in light of his heart murmur and caveat about Pepcid AC. -- How many times a day do you give tramadol 25mgs? Let us know that you understand the time and circumstances it takes to heal a disc where it is safe before beginning physical activity.
The centerpiece of "DISC disease" treatment is the healing of the disc via limited movement of the back via a recovery suite. 100% STRICT crate rest 24/7 for 8 weeks provides limited movement to allow good strong disc scar tissue to form. -- Super tried and true tips for setting up the recovery suite: www.dodgerslist.com/literature/CrateRRP.htm -- PLUS further guidance on conservative treatment on our "All Things IVDD page: www.dodgerslist.com/literature/healingpage.htm www.dodgerslist.com/healingindex.htmSTRICT means: - no laps - no couches - no baths - no sleeping with you - no chiro therapy - no dragging or meandering at potty times. Carry your Jake to and from the recovery suite to the potty place and then allow a very, very few limited footsteps. Using a sling (long winter scarf, ace bandage, belt) will save your back and help to keep a wobbly dog's back aligned and butt from tipping over. A harness and 6 foot leash is to control speed and keep footsteps to minimum as you stand in one spot. An ex-pen in the grass is an excellent alternative to minimizing footsteps with the physical and visual to indicate there will be no sniff festing going on!
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Post by Elke & Jake on Mar 15, 2019 20:23:01 GMT -7
Hi Paula, Thank you for your reply! He's on Tramadol 1x a day. He started eating grass yesterday March 14, so I took your suggestion and called vet to ask about stomach protector for him, which they gave me the ok.
[Moderator's Note. Please do not edit 19lbs Metacam as of 3/13: 20# dose 1x/day for 14 days, then 3/27 test stop for pain/neuro issues methocarbamol 250mgs 3x/day tramadol 25mgs 1x/day ✙famotidine 5mgs 2x/day]
So thank you for reminding me of that! I started him on a generic ✙Pepcid Ac with his breakfast and dinner. It seems to help, as he's stopped eating grass. I thought only steroids caused him to urinate more frequently, but perhaps not. I've noticed an increase in him urination and an increase in thirst. His bowl movements are regular and normal. I have him on strict crate rest and he's not thrilled about it but he's a trooper. Yesterday March 14 and today March 15 he stumbled when walking. Today March 15 he returned his paws back pretty quickly when I flipped them, so that is a good sign. I carry him out to potty and to his food bowl. I forgot how hard crating a pup is on my body! Last time I had groin issues from squatting down to get him in his crate and this time my shoulder is feeling the pain supporting him properly. But we are in it for the long-haul! I learned last time not to waste my time unless it's 100% strict crate rest, so I'm determined we'll get through this even though it seems overwhelming at times. I am trying to take it one day at a time and not look ahead to weeks...Jakey and I can do this! =)
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Marjorie
Moderator~
Member since 2011. Surgery & Conservative
Posts: 5,724
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Post by Marjorie on Mar 16, 2019 6:15:02 GMT -7
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PaulaM
Moderator.
Member since 2007: surgery, conservative . Montana, USA
Posts: 19,540
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Post by PaulaM on Mar 16, 2019 7:53:52 GMT -7
For how many days is the Metacam to be given? How many mgs is each famotidine (generic Pepcid AC) dose that you are giving 2x/day?
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Post by Elke & Jake on Mar 19, 2019 11:59:21 GMT -7
Jake is now getting his breakfast and dinner in bed aka inside his crate! He's on Metacam for 2 weeks. He's taking 5 mg of generic Pepsid AC each meal. I wonder if I should give 10 mg? I re-read my vet notes from 2015 and they suspected IVDD back then stating that his accident with a dog door exacerbated his IVDD. I think I also misstated that it's been 4 1/2 years since his last episode but it's been 3 1/2 years. Jakey is doing pretty good. His back paws do not knuckle and he hasn't stumbled for a few days. He's eating well and continues to do his potty business easily. The past two days, he has tried to eat grass again. He seems fairly happy considering he's restricted and does not seem in pain. One week ago today, I crated Jake and he went to the vet and started his meds in the afternoon. I had a question about steroid treatment versus non-steroid. What are your thoughts on Prednisone (steroid) or non-steroidal anti-inflammatory drugs such as Rimadyl and Metacam for conservative treatment while on crate rest? In 2015 he was on Prednisone while being on strict crate rest. I feel he recovered fairly well. This time Jake is seeing a new doctor and they have him on Metacam. I believe the vet chose this due to his senior age (11) and some concerns from xray (enlarged liver) and high calcium number in bloodwork. The Metacam seems to have less visible side effects for Jake this time around compared to Prednisone--less panting, less urination with no bed wetting, less anxiety.
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Post by Romy & Frankie on Mar 19, 2019 13:35:00 GMT -7
I am very glad that Jake is doing well. The usual dose of Pepcid AC in dogs is .44mgs per lb. For Jake at 19 lbs that comes to 8.36mgs so right in the middle. You could round up to 10mgs. Both Metacam, an NSAID, and prednisone, a steroid, work on swelling. Both can cause excess stomach acid which Pepcid AC can help avoid. The steroid class of medicine is stronger. Both types of meds have side effects. The side effects you mention for pred are temporary and will stop when the pred stops. Metacam and other NSAIDS have side effects also. They can also cause stomach damage. Since Jake is eating well and no problems with diarrhea, the Pepcid AC is doing a good job protecting his stomach. Since Jake's neuro deficits are minimal an NSAID is a fine choice for him. We have some information about these meds here: www.dodgerslist.com/literature/drugs.htm
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Post by Elke & Jake on Mar 28, 2019 11:07:06 GMT -7
Thanks for info on Pepcid AC and NSAIDs and Steroids.
Jake finished his meds on 3/26, after two weeks. He continues to be on crate rest (6 more weeks to go!) and is doing well with no pain, eating normal, moving normal, potty stuff normal. His slightly limps sometimes with his back right leg which is normal for him since his injury in 2015. After the 8 week period, I will take him for a followup vet appt and to get a blood test. His calcium level was high at his last blood test about 2 weeks ago. Jakey seems happy and does well in the crate but he's antsy and likes lot's of potty breaks out of the crate! We are both hoping the next 6 weeks go by quickly for a full recovery!
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Post by Romy & Frankie on Mar 28, 2019 13:24:47 GMT -7
Good news that Jake is doing well. Once our dogs start to feel better they often want to get going. They think they are fine. We pet parents know better. We know that the minimum amount of movement during crate rest is what will heal the disc.
Here are some ideas for keeping Jake occupied while in his crate:
Place the crate near a window with a view, on the coffee table in front of couch where you sit.
Place the crate so the dog will be in the middle of family activities, near your bed at night.
Secure crate to a flat moving dolly (or put casters on plywood) to easily move the crate room to room.
Fill a kong with a slight slather of soft dog food and freeze. Put part of the dog's total daily dinner kibble in the kong to lengthen time to consume dinner. Good low cal snacks are carrots, apples, or frozen green beans, licking a frozen low sodium broth ice cube
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Post by Elke & Jake on May 7, 2019 5:59:04 GMT -7
Jakey has completed his crate rest! He is doing well and feeling fabulous! Physically, he is back to where he was before his latest episode. His nerve damage from a few years ago remains (slight barely noticeable limp on rear right leg) but he is pain free, happy, mobile, and very active. I have replaced his two-step stairs to the couch with a ramp. I hope to take Jakey in for a followup and blood test to check on some off numbers soon. Thank you for all your help! It was a long 8 weeks but Jakey graduated with high marks! =)
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PaulaM
Moderator.
Member since 2007: surgery, conservative . Montana, USA
Posts: 19,540
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Post by PaulaM on May 7, 2019 6:15:56 GMT -7
Elke, congratulations on Jake's graduation....you did it, you took conservative principals seriously providing Jake with the absolute best potential to heal his disc and not further damage his spinal cord. Good job. Now begins a gradual easing back into more normal activity. The idea is to gradually give more freedom under controlled conditions. Not free reign of the house and yard immediately-- I know Jake will think otherwise with his desire to be active! LOL Take a look at our information and then come up with a plan to gradually increase activity over about a month's time following the end of crate rest. Also check out how to teach four paws on the floor! www.dodgerslist.com/literature/AfterCrateRest.htmGood job on the ramp to the couch. If there are are steps to the back yard, that should have a ramp too. Other pieces of furniture need blocking off? All those ideas and more are in this link: www.dodgerslist.com/literature/protectback.htmDon't be a stranger, please do check in every now and then. We LOVE updates! Maybe you will see a new member needing your support...you've been there and done that successfully.
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