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Post by Pauliana on Sept 21, 2018 22:30:09 GMT -7
Hi Wanda, You and Porschia went through so much with the unsuccessful procedure..I feel for both of you! Conservative treatment has worked for many thousands of dogs so don't ever give up hope.. Dogs never give up because they know where there is a will there is a way! She can still have a great quality of life! dodgerslist.com/index/SDUNCANquality.htmBe sure to check the diaper frequently to make sure she doesn't get a rash.. If she does get a rash you could try Aquaphor cream around the anus or another rash cream that does not contain zinc.Healing thoughts and prayers!
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Post by Wanda & Porschia on Sept 22, 2018 5:16:34 GMT -7
Question now, We got up in the middle of the night to express her since she was still coming out of having the IV in her arm plus being on the Dex and everything else. We got up at 3 am and 6:30 and expressed her. My question is she drinks water 24 hours a day. I mean her water bowl that is attached to her crate where she can get it she drinks and drinks. At night in your experiences do you still have water in their crates 24-7? I have never in my life seen so much pee come out of a 20 lb dog. She pees more than I do. When we start expressing she is very tense by the end of it she is very relaxed. I lay her on her side on a pee pad and when she pees and the pad fills I put paper towels down to soak it up so it doesn't get on her. Then I take a wipe and clean the pee off her body. Right now it is so strong of a smell since she got back from the specialist. I need a go fund me account for paper towels. I still have to giggle a little or else with all that goes on in my house I would be in the nut house. You see I can't remember if I explained all my animals or not. Total I have five dogs and three inside cats. Ok dog number one Aussie(rescue) she just got over outside ripping off a dew claw so they were both removed. She wore a cone for 6 weeks to get them both healed. 55 lbs. I have a blue heeler that was in a kill shelter because of epilepsy.35 lbs She was due to be put down within the hour and I took her. She has a brain tumor on phenobarbital 32.4 mg and CBD oil. She has tremors not seizures as the doctor suspected. I have a 3 lb and 5 lb Chihuahua that was rescued with seizures but only one or two every three months. They are on CBD oil. Porschia who is a very special dog to me even though all my animals are my special babies. Now the cats two I bottle fed one is in renal failure due to her kidneys never developed. Her mom threw her away at three weeks old. (black cat) My white cat with beautiful blue eyes she is healthy. Then my Himalayan with a white mustache was rescued from someone who throws cats in for dog fights. I am a volunteer for a non profit who helps people in our county get their animals fixed. Most of my work is from home so I get calls and sign people up to help them if they can't afford to fix their animals. The non profit that I am a volunteer at raises money and takes donations to help them. Then we volunteer for a wildlife rescue and sometimes I have screech owls in my aviary nursing back to help because they have been imprinted or have one wing one foot and can't be released. Then twice a week we carry dog food/cat food to food pantries to help feed pets in our community. Oh and I take care of my 83 year old mother who lives in a house behind me. So if I ask questions or vent it is because my brain is so full I feel like Porschia's bladder sometimes, on overflow. I have since the beginning of Porschia's healing process thought she has to have water at all times. Please tell me if that is correct. Porschia is going to heal and Porschia is going to walk again. She is going to beat all odds. I feel it in my heart. Thank you from the bottom of my heart for all this wonderful information.
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PaulaM
Moderator.
Member since 2007: surgery, conservative . Montana, USA
Posts: 19,540
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Post by PaulaM on Sept 22, 2018 8:22:18 GMT -7
Wanda, unbelievably amazing the good work you do—you have a full time job many times over! I would really monitor that strong urine smell. It may be caused by some meds given at the hospital or it may be a sign of a UTI developing. There are other reasons for increased drinking. Once Dex is under way and certainly when fully stopped--- if the drinking does not go back to normal, time to tell the vet your observation of very excessive drinking. NOTE: yes a sling would put pressure on the bladder to kinda express some urine out. NEVER should one depend on a sling to express! It takes a human who can feel the bladder in all stages of emptying to know when expressing has emptied the bladder. Bladders not fully emptied naturally fill up again too quickly and BAM you have another overflowing bladder event too soon. Dex is one steroid that does NOT cause as much thirst as prednisone. So there is concern WHY is Porchia drinking so much water and still doing it since the 9/21 dex taper started. Too much of anything is not good. Too much water dilutes the necessary minerals in the blood. Bananas with bright yellow skins, a very few brown speckles contain electrolytes and other nutrients. Excessive water intake tends to flush the body nutrients. By eating some banana, some of those nutrients might be restored. Normally last drink of the night could be about 8 pm with before bedtime expessing at 10pm. Depends, you may be able to sleep through til 6am or you'll see you might have to do a mid way in the night expressing session. BTW the word "peeing" means the animal has bladder control to pee. Porchia's bladder can overflow or you can express her bladder but she can NOT "pee". DEX Now that the Dexamethasone taper started on 9/21 (now at 0.5mgs 1x/day) your job is to monitor for pain. If there is pain you may not be able to tell. Methocarbamol is a pain med masking pain! Vets will either back off of the pain meds or full stop at the begin of the Dex taper to enable you to correctly identify pain. Currently methocarbamol is still being given at 1/4 of a 750mg tab every 8 hours?? It has NOT been backed off?
Are you able to see any signs of pain with the since the Dex taper yesterday? When will methocarbamol be stopped?◻︎ shivering-trembling ◻︎ yelping when picked up or moved ◻︎ slow to move ◻︎ tight tense tummy ◻︎ arched back, ears pinned back ◻︎ head held high or nose to the ground. ◻︎ restless, can't find a comfortable position ◻︎ slow or reluctant to move much in crate such as shift positions ◻︎ not their normal perky interested in life selves In your busy schedule, when you can find time ———Porchia's breeder needs to know that Porchia has been diagnosed with IVDD. Ethical breeders would want to know so they can make sure to try and breed the disease out of future litters. Porchia's offspring are more likely to have the potential to have been born with IVDD and thus should never be bred. The owners of any of Porchia's puppies should be aware of what IVDD is and what action to take. Our FAQ page with those details: www.dodgerslist.com/faq.htmIt is your right and duty to know every med that goes into your dog's body. It is your vet's responsibility to NOT hide what your dog takes but instead to inform/educate you. Your own knowledge is a critical part of monitoring at home, being able to question when needed, acting like a nurse at home to double check for contraindicated things, etc. Here on the Forum we are at a disadvantage, as well, to make useful comments when we are in the dark about what exactly Porchia is taking. So I would find out what exactly is the name of the IVDD homeopathic so that you have the ability to look up each of the ingredients. Most experienced holistic vets would NOT Rx a liquid combo of herbal ingredients while conventional meds are on board too much chance one may be contraindicated.
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Post by Wanda & Porschia on Sept 22, 2018 9:16:33 GMT -7
Paula, the IVDD holistic medicine Porschia is not getting. That has been stopped.
[Moderator's note: please do not modify 20 lbs no crate rest RX'd by vet 1 nor holistic vet !!! prednisone as of 8/23?? : 5mgs 2x/day for 3 days, then 8/26 taper dex as of 9/7: 0.5mgs 2x/day for 14 days, then 9/21 taper to test for pain/neuro methocarbamol 750 tab: 187.5mgs 3x/day walking around at vet disc relapsed 9/12 Crate rest as of 9/18 IVDD homeopathic 1 squirt 10x/day SToPPED Pepcid AC 5mgs 2x/day]
The taper is still going on. She will be on Dex for 7 days the 26th will be the last day for x1 daily then she goes to every other day 1 x.and the vet said she will stay on Methocarbamol until after the Steroid is gone. Porschia's last express it was not yellow and did not smell. Also my vet will work with me in any way I need her. She knows I am doing the conservative way with strict crate rest until Nov 14th unless she gets sick and has to go to her. The holistic vet I am holding off on that one, not that she isn't good I just feel I trust this group more.
as far as the pain, the only thing I have seen Porschia do was have a tense belly when being picked up. She doesn't do any of the other things. Her ears stand up and lay down, she has a strange look in her eyes like help me and after she is expressed she is content.
Porschia's breeder or previous owner was contacted. She said last year Dec. Porschia went to a vet for stomach problems and laid in her bed all the time. She also said what is IVDD and I told her, then in the same breath she said her English Bull dog had a blood test that said he is IVDD positive on two counts. I don't think that person knows what she is talking about. You see so many lies she has been caught in with me, she said Porschia came to her pg from a breeder and I said was she born with no tail or what. Then she said when she was born she had no tail. If you ask her something the story changes. We think she was the breeder I only have a cell phone number I don't even know where she lives. She gave me Porschia in Home Depot parking lot with no even a leash. Then I was given her AKC papers registered to her. So she has been told. Back yard breeding is horrible. I don't even think she is in my town any longer. They move around. I made her sign Porschia over to me and sign it that in no way shape or form can she come back and have her. Just me protecting Porschia.
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PaulaM
Moderator.
Member since 2007: surgery, conservative . Montana, USA
Posts: 19,540
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Post by PaulaM on Sept 22, 2018 9:33:46 GMT -7
There is no point to staying on a pain masking pain med til Dex is fully stopped when your job is to get a clear assessment about pain! Methocarbamol would be backed off by some vets to avoid rebound pain, other vets will just stop methocarbamol at the begin of Dex taper. Find out WhICH your vet prefers backing off OR full stop of methocarbamoal.
How often are you currently giving methocarbmaol 1/4 of 750 mg tab: 2x or 3x/day?
Tight tummy could be pain, could be learned pain and tightening in acticipation of thinking it may again be painful on lifting.
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Post by Wanda & Porschia on Sept 22, 2018 9:50:30 GMT -7
Methocarbmaol 3x/day 1/4 of 750 mg; Pepcid 5 mg x 2; Meth to be stopped when the last Dex is given.
That is all the medication Porschia is on. Nothing else. I believe her tight tummy was because she had a bowel movement in there and it made her tummy tight. she had a bowel movement today. I was told Methocarbamol is a muscle relaxer [pain med] also. So since I am tapering my vet said she would follow what I want.
So should I start backing off of the Methocarbamol to see if pain is present since I am on day three of 1x day Dex?
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Post by Romy & Frankie on Sept 22, 2018 13:17:27 GMT -7
When a taper is begun without the pain meds being stopped or cut down it is harder to tell if the swelling in the spinal cord is gone. This is because pain is an indicator of spinal cord swelling. The pain meds may mask any pain that is present so it will take longer to be sure that all the swelling is gone. If the vet gave you an option of cutting down the Methocarbamol during the taper it is a good idea to do that. If Porschia shows any signs of pain when you cut back the Methocarbamol you will know that swelling is still present and Porschia would then need to go back on the full dose of dex and the pain meds until another taper is tried.
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Post by Wanda & Porschia on Sept 22, 2018 20:35:20 GMT -7
Well here is it 11:35 in the night and Porschia had wet panties so when I took her and put her on her changing table and expressing was a tiny tiny drop of red blood. Now I know why she is constantly thirsty and running like a faucet. In the morning I will put a phone call into my vet so she will send in a prescription for a UTI. I can't take her water away tonight because she probably needs it to stay hydrated. You would have thought when she was at the doctor and I told her we are doing the conservative way and she said yes her bladder is empty and we are doing it the right way. We talked about how much she gives when I express her and no comment was made. Sometimes I really wonder. I guess it is like anything else, Doctors for human's also.
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Post by Pauliana on Sept 22, 2018 21:38:23 GMT -7
Hopefully when the antibiotics kick in, Porschia will feel better.. Let us know what the Vet prescribes.. Remind the Vet again about how much she is drinking and that you are concerned about that.. Sometimes we have to push and push to get the info out of the Vet.. Some things seem to go right over their heads.. With many patients with all kinds of problems, they can miss things if we aren't pushy at times...
You have your hands full for sure, bless you for all that you do!
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Post by Wanda & Porschia on Sept 23, 2018 6:03:14 GMT -7
Hi Pauliane, As soon as I find out what was sent in I will let you know. I do know this morning her urine had a pink tint to it. Not good, however many things could have called that I do know. She had a catheter the 20th and maybe even until we picked her up on the 21st. Poor Porschia, she is a real trooper she has not cried out in pain or anything. I do know now that is why so much urine, I have never seen so much, overflow well she must have three tanks to have so much in there, I will do what I have to for Porschia for as long as I can. I am tired, Calgon take me away didn't work. lol I don't use that it cause a yeast infection, but soaking in the tub didn't help ............. I just want Porschia to be comfortable and her ears still stick up when she sees me go for blueberries or carrots or green beans for her. Those are my dogs treats, I will let you know what the doctor gives her. I have called the pharmacy and told them what she was on to make sure they work together not against each other. Then when they call me and tell me what it is I will do my research if I don't know what it is. Thank you everyone
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Post by Wanda & Porschia on Sept 23, 2018 10:07:40 GMT -7
I wonder where my quick reply went. ✚Amox-Clav 500 mg x2 daily for 7 days.
[Moderator's note: please do not modify 20 lbs no crate rest RX'd by vet 1 nor holistic vet !!! prednisone as of 8/23?? : 5mgs 2x/day for 3 days, then 8/26 taper dex as of 9/7: 0.5mgs 2x/day for 14 days, then 9/21 taper to test for pain/neuro methocarbamol 750 tab: 187.5mgs 3x/day walking around at vet disc relapsed 9/12 Crate rest as of 9/18 Pepcid AC 5mgs 2x/day ✚Amox-Clav 500 mg x2 daily for 7 days. ]
I sure hope this helps her. she is still on the taper 1x/day Dex and Meth 1/4 750 mg 2x/day and Pepcid 5mg 2x/day. So hopefully it will knock out whatever is going on in her little bladder/kidneys UTI please let this help her and maybe she will stop drinking so much. While she has a UTI or whatever maybe from the Catheter. Just hope she has no side effects from this strong medication.
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Post by Wanda & Porschia on Sept 23, 2018 19:54:38 GMT -7
Amox-Clav 500 mg x 2 daily for 7 days starting Sept 23 rd. Porschia got 2 doses today and by the second dose and her Dex and Meth and Pepcid she got them all spaced out and with food each time. she had a panting panting not comfortable for three hours finally I called the pharmacy and he said Benadryl for children do you have any? give her 2 CC. Now three hours later she is finally settling down somewhat. Tomorrow morning a call to the doctor and maybe she will half that dose. It seems to strong for a 20 lb dog when as an adult that is a dose I would take. I think it gave her gas, belly ache and she just plain was miserable. We laid her on her changing table and sat with her for three hours while she just laid there. I am trying everyone but so far for three nights no sleep and up almost all night this is a test of my strength and will. Sometimes I am scared and I really wonder if there isn't something else wrong with Porschia that I was not told.
----- Post by Wanda & Porschia on 9/23 at 11:07am I wonder where my quick reply went. ✚Amox-Clav 500 mg x2 daily for 7 days.
[Moderator's note: please do not modify 20 lbs no crate rest RX'd by vet 1 nor holistic vet !!! prednisone as of 8/23?? : 5mgs 2x/day for 3 days, then 8/26 taper dex as of 9/7: 0.5mgs 2x/day for 14 days, then 9/21 taper to test for pain/neuro methocarbamol 750 tab: 187.5mgs 3x/day walking around at vet disc relapsed 9/12 Crate rest as of 9/18 Pepcid AC 5mgs 2x/day ✚Amox-Clav 500 mg x2 daily for 7 days. ]
I sure hope this helps her. she is still on the taper 1x/day Dex and Meth 1/4 750 mg 2x/day and Pepcid 5mg 2x/day. So hopefully it will knock out whatever is going on in her little bladder/kidneys UTI please let this help her and maybe she will stop drinking so much. While she has a UTI or whatever maybe from the Catheter. Just hope she has no side effects from this strong medication.
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Marjorie
Moderator~
Member since 2011. Surgery & Conservative
Posts: 5,724
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Post by Marjorie on Sept 24, 2018 5:37:07 GMT -7
Amox-Clav can cause gas and stomach pain, Wanda. Do let us know what the vet says after speaking to her this morning.
Caring for a dog through an IVDD episode can be very stressful and Wanda has had a particularly hard time of it. Prayers that all will be better for both of you today and that you will be able to get some much needed rest.
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Post by Wanda & Porschia on Sept 24, 2018 10:15:42 GMT -7
Alright I am back from the vet. ✚Amoxicillin 250 mg x 2 for 7 days.
[Moderator's note: please do not modify 20 lbs no crate rest RX'd by vet 1 nor holistic vet !!! prednisone as of 8/23?? : 5mgs 2x/day for 3 days, then 8/26 taper dex as of 9/7: 0.5mgs 2x/day for 14 days, then 9/21 taper to test for pain/neuro methocarbamol 750 tab: 187.5mgs ▼1x/day til 9/30 of Dex final taper dose walking around at vet disc relapsed 9/12 Crate rest as of 9/18 Pepcid AC 5mgs 2x/day Augmenton (Amox-Clav) 500 mg x2 daily STOPPED ✚Amoxicillin 250mg 2x/day for 7 days]
Stop Augmentin 500 mg to hard on stomach and made her vomit and panting uncontrollably, stomach ache and honestly last night I thought Porschia was dying. She hurt so much. I gave her Benadryl per the pharmacy 2 cc. however in the future I can give her 25 mg pill when she is in so much anxiety and pain. This morning Porschia is resting peacefully and when I say cookie her ears perk up and she ate her cookie. She ate a good breakfast , we are tapering per the doctor her Dex to every other day and ▼Methocarbmaol once a day, when her Dex has stopped she will be put on Tramadol or some other kind of pain medication. So today no Dex tomorrow I will give her one. I for the life of me don't understand how three different doctors all have different opinions, different medications and different views on things. I myself want the control over my baby. I want her over this UTI and when the steriods are over maybe Tramadol or Metcam for pain and she how she does. They are trying to wean her.... Now for the urine, it has slowed down a lot. Maybe something is happening for the good. She is drinking but not as much as she was. One Dex a day and now every other day might be the key to that problem.
So her medications are as follows Amoxicillin 250 mg 2x/day for 7 days Methocarbmaol 1/4 of 750 mg 1x/day until Dex is discontinued Pepcid 5g 2x/day Dex 1x every other day with first one tomorrow 9/24/18 skipping today 9/23/18
Everything else on the lists has been discontinued.
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PaulaM
Moderator.
Member since 2007: surgery, conservative . Montana, USA
Posts: 19,540
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Post by PaulaM on Sept 24, 2018 11:45:23 GMT -7
Wanda, glad to hear it was as simple as the amox/clav combo did not agree with her, the plain Amox should do just as good a job, I have read.
Glad to hear production of urine has reduced!!!!!
With the culmination of the Dex taper AND there is no pain showing...why would anyone then add in a pain reliever?? For what reason???
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Post by Wanda & Porschia on Sept 24, 2018 13:11:09 GMT -7
Paula that is my thoughts, they wanted the Dex taper I was told she didn't need it any longer. That will stop the panting and the peeing all the time. I think she should have pain medicine now and all the doctors say if you can't feel your hind legs you are not in pain.[? ?] I know she is in pain. Methocarbo is an old time muscle relaxer and the Specialist says it is for muscle relaxing and spasms, it does nothing for pain. They won't put her on pain medication, only steriods and methocarbo. antibiotics, I am going to give her Meloxidyl for her weight there is a gauge that tells for weight. I hear Porschia moaning like a little faint moan, her breaths fast and I know she has pain. Now that came from Two specialists a holistic vet and my primary vet. So I said I KNOW SHE HAS PAIN. She is still panting a little but not all the time. I guess vets are like doctors everyone has opinions and not all agree. So would you add Meloxidyl to her medication. [NO!!!!] I asked for Tramadol and was told nope she doesn't need it.
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PaulaM
Moderator.
Member since 2007: surgery, conservative . Montana, USA
Posts: 19,540
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Post by PaulaM on Sept 24, 2018 13:46:00 GMT -7
Wanda, there MUST be a 5-7 days wahsout between steroid<>NSAID and NSAID<>NSAID. DO NOT GIVE Meloxidyl until there has been 5-7 days from last dose of Dex! DO NOT subject Porchia to a danger to GI tract combo of Dex steroid with a non-steroid drug!!
1. Dex and other steroids can cause painting. Panting could also be a sign of pain. Thus needing to put on your detective had to find out if there is actually pain. Seeing two or more signs of pain is helpful in pinpointing if actually in pain. Tell us what you observe in Porchia which makes you sure she is in pain:
SIGNS OF PAIN ◻︎ shivering-trembling ◻︎ yelping when picked up or moved ◻︎ slow to move ◻︎ tight tense tummy ◻︎ arched back, ears pinned back ◻︎ head held high or nose to the ground. ◻︎ restless, can't find a comfortable position ◻︎ slow or reluctant to move much in crate such as shift positions ◻︎ not their normal perky interested in life selves
While Porchia may no longer have the ability to feel a deep pain sensation (DPS) when the correct kind of pressure is applied to the back paws. If she is hurting and showing the above signs of pain then of course she feel pain and would necessitate having pain meds on board! These two terms can be confusing because of the word "pain". But they are totally two different things.
There are three usual kinds of PAIN with a disc episode. One of of those is from painful muscle contractions. The pain med methocarbamol deals with that particular kind of pain.
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Post by Michelle & Keira on Sept 24, 2018 14:27:52 GMT -7
Hi Wanda, You are doing a great job in caring for Porchia. It sounds like you are keen to explore all options to help heal Porchia. I just thought I'd mention a Facebook page - IVDD Answers. They specialise in stem cell treatment in the US. I don't know how effective it is, but if you look at their page, they appear to have some success treating IVDD dogs. Wishing you and Porchia all the very best. Michelle
[Moderator's note: Dodgerslist has been asked several times about Stem Cell Therapy for IVDD. At the present time there has not been enough publicized research for us to support.
There is research going on now at Colorado State and we are watching for their published results. Stephanie McGrath, DVM, MS, Diplomate ACVIM (Neurology) Assistant Professor, Neurology/Neurosurgery wrote on 8/9/18 she did not have any data to share yet.
Dodgerslist advises to research thoroughly before using on your dog.]
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Post by Wanda & Porschia on Sept 24, 2018 14:31:46 GMT -7
Paula Porschia's Doctor said methocarbamol is a muscle relaxer if the muscles are contracting. Which the doctor seems to think weening her because nothing is helping her or hurting her. two of her doctors wanted to give her NSAID and Steroid at the same time and I said no. That is why I am telling you each doctor is giving different ideas because they really don't know. I guess that is why they want her off steriods and then give her pain medication. NSAID's.
Porschia since I have had her really has always had her ears back. She is just now putting her ears up. Once she gets confortable she lays down and sleeps. Now moaning I call that pain for her. Move around she can't move much she pulls herself up on her front legs to get a drink. She is tight but once you pick her up she is good. Porschia has never barked, yelped vocal at all. Porschia has never been perky, never ran, never chased a ball or anything. She is slow to move because the only thing she has is to drag her legs and I pick her up to change her and relieve her bladder and then put her back in her crate. Remember she is on strict kennel rest. I have never dealt with IVDD ever but I can tell you how to feed kittens, how to pee them, poop them, the same with puppies, I can tell you how to worm them and raise them, I can tube feed neo baby squirrels, possums and all kinds of animals. I took my pre classes to go to vet school and got married instead. However I have never in all these years had an animal with this. IVDD after Porschia's rest and if God willing she walks somewhat I will be so thankful however if she doesn't I want her in a cart so she can be a dog and smile again. I am so frustrated with this advise from this specialist, this dr. saying this and everyone of them is different. Taking off steriods and the methocarbo came from two Specialists at Blue Pearl who said less than 10 % for her. So what would you do? I do know she hasn't drank much, her appetite is wonderful and relieving her today has been wonderful.
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PaulaM
Moderator.
Member since 2007: surgery, conservative . Montana, USA
Posts: 19,540
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Post by PaulaM on Sept 24, 2018 14:51:29 GMT -7
Wanda, no one not even specialists are privy to a working crystal ball. Sure they can make a guess that there is only a 10% chance of walking...but that is it... it IS a guess. We here at Dodgerslist have seen too many dogs given dire changes of walking and the dog's body does a "miracle." It self repairs nerves and the dog walks. It may take many months --close to a year OR in some cases just not enough nerve repair happened.. So we say, never give up, stay the course, stay strong and see what Porchia and mother nature can do.
Vets who want to give NSAID and steroid at the same time when deemed an emergency situation without a washout and without then using double GI tract protection (sucralfate + Pepcid AC) need to attend continuing education classes and get up to speed. Good thing you were aware and could protect Porchia.
So the specialists at Blue Pearl want to go ahead with the test for pain finishing out of Dex and the stop of methocarbamol. That seems reasonable UNLESS you actually are certain she is currently still in pain (hurting). --- If pain, then strongly advocate with your local vet to get some pain meds on aboard 1) tramadol as the general analgesic 2) gabapentin for nerve pain 3) if there are still painful contractions of muscles, muscle spasms, then methocarbamol
Switching to the lessor of the two classes of anti-inflammatory drugs (the non-steorid NSAIDs) takes either a 5-7 day washout OR double GI tract protection of RX sucralfate + over the counter Pepcid AC (famotidine). To move to a lessor class (NSAIDs) can be problematic...why not stay at the most powerful (steroid class), the more apt to get swelling down quickly IF THERE IS STILL painful swelling going on? --- When on pred for the 3 days, was thirst/urination the same as with Dex. Dex is not supposed to cause as must thirsty/urine production as pred does.
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Post by Wanda & Porschia on Sept 24, 2018 16:53:52 GMT -7
She was at the beginning Aug 23rd until Sept 7th ended Pred....that morning stopped. Then Sept 7th evening she started on the Dex .5 mg x2/day. Thirst has been more with the Dex and more urine with the Dex than with the Pred. This Dex has changed her a lot, even torn up her belly, Now I did find out today by calling Blue Pearl she did have a catheter in, and reading Dex does cause panting and UTI. She was only on Pred for less than two weeks. Tonight Sept 24th is her first off day of Dex and not a lot of urine at all. No stressing no tightening her body. She doesn't move around a lot but she perks up when she hears the cookie jar rattle. I am fighting for dear Life for my Porschia. When I love an animal I love so deep. More than with husbands. I have had two of those and never again lol. I will take my dogs and cats any day. That is why every animal I have is female. I have an Isabella, Roxie, Porschia, Bindi, Pia Zadora, cats Purdy, Willow and Sasha, So I will continue to try with all my heart and will for all of my animals and specially Porschia because right now she needs me the MOST........ Thank you for all your kind words and prayers, Keep praying.
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PaulaM
Moderator.
Member since 2007: surgery, conservative . Montana, USA
Posts: 19,540
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Post by PaulaM on Sept 24, 2018 19:08:31 GMT -7
Wanda, then is sounds as if Porchia on the dex taper so far is not showing signs of pain. She may have been painful from the UTI too. So as a conclusive test for pain, have you stopped methocarbamol?
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Post by Wanda & Porschia on Sept 25, 2018 5:15:41 GMT -7
She is on one a day of methocarbamol until the UTI and Dex are over. Today is the 25th she get 1x/ Dex (every other day) then the 28th and 30th she is done. Per instruction of the Specialist. Porschia started the Dex 2x/day Sept 7th. By the 10th she was pee pee constantly and drink drink drink. She didn't go to a specialist until the 20th of Sept when they put a catheter in and on the 23rd we saw blood in her urine and her urine was pink on the pad. The reason I know is because of being in a diaper and when I relieve her there was pink on the pee pad. I have a calender to write everything down.( I am one of the organized ones) by the
18th she was not walking at all. 18th a laser and 19th laser and told she has lost all DPS. 20th at Blue Pearl for the SX-Myelogram that was unsuccessful. I think the Doctors attempted that one 25 pokes in her skin on her back.
I do believe Porschia had a peaceful sleep last night. We got up at 3 am no water had been drank out of her bowl and her diaper had very little pee in it. We changed her diaper and helped her and no pee
then 7 am on the 25th a little pee in her diaper. She ate a full breakfast and drank a little water, took her Pepcid 5 mg (before she ate 30 minutes) and then with her food her amoxicillin 250mg No panting no moaning and resting again.
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PaulaM
Moderator.
Member since 2007: surgery, conservative . Montana, USA
Posts: 19,540
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Post by PaulaM on Sept 25, 2018 5:57:42 GMT -7
Wanda, good news then that pain is in control and urination is getting to a more normal state.
Until methocarbamol has been stopped, there is no proof with the test for pain Dex taper whether the painful spinal cord swelling is really gone.
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Post by Wanda & Porschia on Sept 25, 2018 9:37:51 GMT -7
How do I test. I did figure out today when she was moaning ok don't laugh we took her diaper off and she made a good poop. I do know how to massage a little around her anus to help her. Ever so gently and out it comes. So Paula the last Dex I should stop the methocarba and see if she gets worse? Basically here now what I say the Dr. says ok the one here in my town, she said anything I need (except pain meds) they want her to have some pain. I want her to have NONE!!! What is wrong with vets? Tonight she gets a dex and we will see how she does. She didn't have one last night and was very peaceful........ Thank you for all your wonderful info even though sometimes I think you are hollering at me.
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PaulaM
Moderator.
Member since 2007: surgery, conservative . Montana, USA
Posts: 19,540
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Post by PaulaM on Sept 25, 2018 10:31:35 GMT -7
At the first day of the dex taper should have been the time to back off or full stop meds that mask pain. So it still not too late to stop the methocarbamol...at this point is has been backed off. Observing if any signs of pain would re-surface once the mask is off (all pain meds have been stopped) Pain= another course of Dex or better prednisone + all pain meds back on board + stomach protection No Pain= just finish out Dex taper to conclusion and finished the 8 weeks of crate rest for the disc to heal. The full details on how Dex, an anti-inflammatory, works with a disc episode. Good reading to be able to ask the right questions and discuss treatment: www.dodgerslist.com/literature/healingsweling.htm
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Post by Wanda & Porschia on Sept 25, 2018 16:15:01 GMT -7
Thank you Paula that was great information. Tomorrow I will not give her the methocarbamol since she is only getting 1xday now. Dex is 1x every other day Pepcid is 2x/day everyday. She is still panting a little not as much, sleeping better, no accidents or overflow in her crate, still getting up at 3 am to check her diaper. Then we stay with her up so her little body can air out. Amoxicillin 250 mg 2x/day . she will finish those on the 30th. I will continue the pepcid to ease her belly.
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Post by Pauliana on Sept 25, 2018 21:56:12 GMT -7
Hi Wanda, Glad to hear that Porschia is improving on the antibiotics.. Panting can be from being too hot,pain or from anxiety and sometimes a side effect of medications.. It's good that she isn't panting as much. To ease panting, put a fan near her but not pointing right at her, to cool the air around her.. No one is yelling at you. We make words bigger to alert you about certain things. Such as not giving any NSAID when Dex or any steroid is in use.. Nsaids aren't pain relievers, they are anti inflammatories that relieve pain after the inflammation is gone and that can take from 7-30 days for some dogs.. Please read this about pain meds: dodgerslist.com/literature/healingpain.htmDon't forget to take care of yourself too!
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Post by Wanda & Porschia on Sept 26, 2018 9:55:10 GMT -7
Today no Methocarbo... It is the skip day of Dex. Only medication Porschia is getting today is Amoxicillin 250 mg x2 day and x/2 day pepcid that is it. So far she is not showing any signs of anything except she wants cookies lol I am taking care of myself. I still get up at 3 am with Porschia and she is sleeping peacefully at the time.
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Post by Wanda & Porschia on Sept 26, 2018 15:50:48 GMT -7
Today probably since she started going to the vet Aug 23rd this is the best day she has had. No moaning no panting, just perky ears, eyes I do think she is smiling for once. The urination is slowed down a lot. NOT much in her diaper but when we take it off the faucet opens. I am going to get a sample of urine and take it to the vet tomorrow to see how it is going. I will keep everyone posted, She is bright eyed................. I know we have a long way to go but today I have a lot of hope for my sweet Angel
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