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Post by Maria & Baxter on Mar 14, 2016 13:23:27 GMT -7
Hi everyone, I'm new to this forum. Wish I'd found it 6 weeks ago!!!
I have an 11 year old Jack russell cross Maltese called Baxter who is now recovering from Ventral Slot surgery in his neck.One morning he woke up screamed in pain and was paralysed.He is 6 weeks post op.He had 4 discs repaired.Nothing could have prepared me for his recovery!!!!So far doing well,but we are also treating him for Cushings disease which thankfully is managed..probably doesn't help with the mobility part as Cushings can affect their hind legs.
Just wanted some advice from anyone who has been through a similar procedure.
We live in a 2 storey house so he is being carried up and down the stairs to the bathroom.He is starting to get very mobile now so I have just bought him some non slip boots for the floorboards which he is allowed to walk on now and have made a huge difference.He is still in a crate at night(though we have been told he can come out of that now..but he seems to not mind it so we'll continue with it.During the day he just pretty much sleeps all day on a mat..he's never been overly active for long periods so we luckily don't have to keep him locked in a crate through the day too.
I still have his double harness on.The specialist has advised he only "gently" play with his toys..so that's out because he thrashes them and he is still in recovery. If I don't get his harness on quickly in the morning he wants to roll over and play with his toys,which the harness prevents him from doing.Would he be ok to have a little roll over on his back by now? I feel like we are stopping him from doing so much..since there is no more up and down the stairs or jumping on the couch and sleeping on my bed.
He is still a little wobbly on his feet.and still has a limp in his front paw as it was the most affected area..My Mum who looks after him while I'm working says he is still sensitive in his neck area.I feel like I have wrapped him in cotton wool...I even panic if he breaks into a little run in the yard.
I'm booking his second physio session this week..and he's been really good doing his exercises 3 times a day.
Has anyone been through this and what can I expect in the coming months?
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PaulaM
Moderator. 
Member since 2007: surgery, conservative . Montana, USA
Posts: 19,528
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Post by PaulaM on Mar 14, 2016 14:18:12 GMT -7
Welcome to Dodgerslist. My name is Paula, what's yours? Let us know which country you live in as it could make a difference in our comment. Your vet has cleared Baxter, then to be off of crate rest which had included doing all the surgeon's directed supervised PT? These pages will give you an idea of how to achieve a gradual increase in activty, neck/back friendly games you can sub for the old ones. How to make your home back friendly, etc. If Baxter is off of crate rest, then a suggestion to begin a slow gradual introduction back to physical activity and life at home how to's for blocking off places he shouldn't be. www.dodgerslist.com/literature/AfterCrateRest.htmwww.dodgerslist.com/literature/protectback.htmNerves can take time to fully heal. So far Baxter is doing well so soon after surgery. What kind of physio is included in the sessions. Is he on any meds at this time for post op? What is observed that indicates pain or sensitivity in his neck? Nose to the ground or head held high? |
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Post by Maria & Baxter on Mar 14, 2016 15:09:38 GMT -7
Hi Paula...thanks for your reply.My name is Maria and I live in Sydney,Australia.
Baxter did really well with no medication to come home with as he was in hospital for 8 days.We only had 2 days of Amoxil to finish off
The physio has given me 2 lots of exercises.
The first is balancing on an incline.I have made a makeshift incline with a ramp with a non slip cover and a box underneath it.Baxter has to hold and balance facing up and down the ramp.The other exercise is the same only he faces N,S,E,W and holds.
He has to sit nose to tail..no lazy leg.He is also supposed to be learning to shake with the other paw that he has never used but that one isn't going to well...he still favours his favourite paw.
My Mum noticed when she tried to hold him near his neck whilst wiping him that he was uncomfortable.I learnt on the very first day of bringing him home that he had to be carried under his belly and chest..and we are still carrying him this way.
He attempted to roll over this morning before I put his harness back on..but I was too scared to let him.Do you think if he is confident to do that then let him?
He is able to have full movement of his neck and he can lift it up high for puppy kisses and treats.
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Marjorie
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Member since 2011. Surgery & Conservative
Posts: 5,724 
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Post by Marjorie on Mar 14, 2016 15:30:09 GMT -7
Hi, Maria. It usually takes a couple of weeks for the swelling from the surgery to go down. Baxter should not have any discomfort in his neck at this point. Have you spoken to the surgeon about the discomfort that you're seeing when he's touched in the neck area? Loss of neuro function with a disc episode is usually seen as a knuckling of a paw (stepping on the top part of the paw) or a crossing of the paws. Limping usually means a reluctance to put weight on a paw, which indicates pain. Again, there shouldn't still be signs of pain 6 weeks post op. You should speak to the surgeon about this, if you haven't already. It could be a sign of nerve root signature pain. It is disc caused but instead of pressure to the spinal cord the pressure is on a nerve root exiting down to the leg. This is painful and makes them not want to bear weight. Dr. Isaacs explains here: www.dodgerslist.com/neurocorner2/rootsignature.htmCould you also clarify what type of double harness you're using? I may have read your postings incorrectly but it sounds as though you put this on him all day to restrict him from rolling over, is that correct? A harness should only be used with a leash when going for a walk. Is this some type of a brace? We don't recommend using braces unless you're working with a qualified IVDD neurologist. Here's our discussion concerning braces: dodgerslist.boards.net/thread/826/back-braces If he's comfortable enough to roll over on his back, then that's a good sign that he has no pain in his back and he can be allowed to do that. I'm more concerned about possible pain in his neck. Please let us know what the surgeon has said about the discomfort when touched in his neck area and the limping and what he feels is causing that. |
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Post by Maria & Baxter on Mar 14, 2016 16:44:42 GMT -7
Hi Marjorie..thanks so much for your reply.
Baxter was operated on by a specialist who specialises in spinal,neurosurgery rehabilatation and orthapedics.He was fantastic,so I have been under his recommendations for recovery.
I don't know the correct term for his harness but you mentioned it being a type of brace and I think it is a better description.It is similar to a harness at the front but it is attached to one that is clipped to one on the back part of the body.Both parts have handles on them and we were using a leash attached to the 2 that was put on by the hospital.
I spoke to the surgeon yesterday and he was very happy with his progress.He did say we can keep using the brace so we can start to assist him with his routine.He did say he could gently play,but since the playing Baxter does is far from gentle we will be looking for different activities for him to do as play.He did say the area may still be tender.He also did say that Baxter may end up with a slight limp given that he had surgery on 4 discs.I When he walks he uses all 4 paws and just occasionally his front left paw tucks under but he will correct it with his next step.That has improved significantly since he first had surgery when he wasn't using it at all and was dragging it.
We are booked in for a physio session this afternoon.
I was worried he may have neck pain but he has been able to move his neck very well since coming home 5 weeks ago.Even the physio was surprised when she was giving me his exercises that the ones for his neck for us to work on he was doing already.Possibly it may have been the way my Mum tried to hold him that may have been uncomfortable for him.I will ask the physio this afternoon.
This morning he did try and roll over to play with his toy but I distracted him worried he may hurt himself...I guess as you said he wouldn't be trying to roll over if he didn't feel confident.
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Marjorie
Moderator~
Member since 2011. Surgery & Conservative
Posts: 5,724
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Post by Marjorie on Mar 14, 2016 17:31:06 GMT -7
Thanks for the clarification on the limp. What you have described, the paw tucking under occasionally, is commonly called knuckling. Knuckling is a result of nerve damage and is not considered a sign of pain. Nerve damage can take a long time to heal but it's a great sign that you've already seen improvement. It's sometimes hard for us to adjust to an IVDD dog's "new normal". This page contains a list of "never-again activities" and "IVDD friendly activities": www.dodgerslist.com/literature/AfterCrateRest.htmHere also is our page on making your home back friendly to help protect against future disc damage: www.dodgerslist.com/literature/protectback.htmIt sounds as though Baxter is in good hands and is lucky to have your loving care. Please do keep us updated on his progress. |
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Post by Maria & Baxter on Mar 15, 2016 0:30:55 GMT -7
Just an update on Baxter.
The physio was super excited with his recovery.She actually didn't think he'd have come so far after his surgery.
Baxter has been given a range of new exercises to do and can now include a 5 minute walk every few days in lieu of his exercises.
He has had the bottom part of his brace taken off so we only have the front part for when we have to guide him.
We'll be going back in 2 weeks for a follow up..happy days :-)
Thanks so much for your reply.
Yes it was explained to us that the return of the use of his foot would depend on whether the nerve was permanently damaged or not.Also if the signal to the brain was getting through...I guess it will all take time.
I think I will always be that over protective Mamma...but I will do whatever it takes to keep him happy and healthy...even with the Cushings disease that little tail never stops wagging...I'm lucky to have Him.
Will keep you posted on what the physio says this afternoon.
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Post by Maria & Baxter on Jun 25, 2016 2:28:43 GMT -7
Hi everyone.. Just wanted your thoughts on this.. Baxter is 4 months post op..he had 4 discs repaired..had strict crate rest..had physio and unfortunately was left with a slight limp on his front paw...limping aside he is gorgeous...and a really happy boy. He just had his 12th birthday. This morning he woke up with a limp on his back leg...I'm in Australia and it's been really cold,so I've kept him rested,rugged up and kept the heating on to keep him comfortable.I'm hoping it's just the cold thats made him a little less agile. He doesn't appear to be in pain..he's eating...so that's always a good sign with him. After surgery he has been banned from stars,jumping..or anything fun like that..which we are very strict with..so he is being carried up and down the stairs of our 2 storey house...I think he likes the pampering.I do find he does struggle with the floorboards..he trips over his Pawz so I don't use them often. I've kept him pretty still today,so no doubt he is a bit stiff. He was taking his weight off the leg...so I put his Pawz back on for stability..and he was trying to weight bare which makes me think he's pulled a muscle or something. If he is still limping tomorrow I'll take him back to the emergency vet..what are your thoughts? I'm trying not to panic....  |
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Marjorie
Moderator~
Member since 2011. Surgery & Conservative
Posts: 5,724
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Post by Marjorie on Jun 25, 2016 4:46:29 GMT -7
Hi, Maria. IVDD is a lifelong disease and any disc in the spine can degenerate enough to tear or rupture at any time, even when all precaution is taken to prevent another disc episode. Not wanting to bear weight on a leg IS a sign of pain. Baxter should be immediately crated to prevent further damage to his spine and seen by a vet to be examined ASAP. Carry him in and out to the vet's office and pad his crate in the car well with blankets/towels to prevent him from being jostled around during transport.
If this is another disc episode and the only symptom remains limping, he would be a good candidate for conservative care, which is 8 full weeks of 100% 24/7 strict crate rest and meds. He would need an anti-inflammatory to reduce the swelling pressing on his spine, pain meds to address the pain until the swelling resolves and a stomach protector to help avoid the side effects of the anti-inflammatory.
Please keep us updated. Prayers that this isn't another disc episode and just a strained muscle.
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Post by Maria & Baxter on Jun 25, 2016 5:08:32 GMT -7
Thanks for your reply Marjorie...I'll keep him rested tonight and hopefully he has some improvement tomorrow if not I'll take him back to the emergency vets where he had his surgery...I'll keep you posted...fingers crossed it's just a strained muscle.
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Post by Maria & Baxter on Jun 25, 2016 21:40:23 GMT -7
Just an update..I have spoken with the emergency hospital where Baxter had his surgery.This morning he is walking on his leg but still not completely 100%...though he is putting weight on it...he is waking like he does when he gets a bur.
The hospital were great and got a surgeon to read through is notes. She said they would be more concerned if the limping was on the leg that was affected in February.Since it is not they are not overly concerned.
I was told unless I think he is in pain..which he doesn't appear to be..that I could wait and go back to my own vet tomorrow.If I feel that it worsens I can call them back and take him in.If I do have to take him I'd rather go back to his surgeon.
He is walking around,though Im encouraging him to rest and the cold weather here in Australia has him firmly planted in front of the gas fire.I will see how he is tomorrow.
Hi everyone..
My boy Baxter had surgery in Feb.He had 4 discs repaired and is going well.
My home has floorboards and I'm finding he has lost muscle tone because he slips when he walks around because he can't keep grip whilst he's walking.
I have kept his nails short and I've made sure the fur between his paw pads is short.
I have spent so much money on so many different "fixes" to no avail...I'm not concerned about the money,I just want something that works.
I have the Paws boots which seem to be ok,but as he walks with his 2 front legs almost touching,he seems to stand on the tip of the boot on the other foot and trips himself over!!
I live in a big 2 level house,so he is carried up and down the stairs..he is very good with this...apart from the 2 times he snuck up and down the stairs and was very pleased with himself..only he saw our reactions weren't the same!!
I have a carpeted section in the lounge area which he is fine on,but the floorboards have him slipping and sliding.
I've done lots of research and am looking for something to wipe onto his paws to create some sticky/tackiness. I don't see him keeping non slip socks on,or boots..or stick on pads..or nail caps.
I'm thinking as silly as this seems I might try some Pole Dancing Grip putty...yes I know this sounds crazy,but from what I've read it prevents slippage,is safe for humans ..and might just do the trick.
The main ingredient is beeswax which creates a tackiness...I thought a little of this smeared on the bottom of his paws might do the trick?
What are your thoughts?
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Marjorie
Moderator~
Member since 2011. Surgery & Conservative
Posts: 5,724
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Post by Marjorie on Jun 26, 2016 5:18:19 GMT -7
Maria, I'm glad Baxter is doing a bit better but I do strongly urge you to keep him strictly crated until you are absolutely sure this isn't a disc problem. If this is another disc that has torn or ruptured, too much movement can cause the disc to tear more with the possibility of nerve damage. As mentioned, limping and not wanting to put weight on a leg IS a sign of pain. Any disc in the spine can rupture at any time with IVDD and can affect any of the four legs according to which disc has ruptured. It would be best not to put anything on Baxter's paws that isn't specifically designed for dogs. Dogs lick their feet and there may be an ingredient that would be harmful if ingested. Rugs are the best way to help Baxter from slipping on smooth flooring. Carpet remnants can be purchased from stores such as Job Lot, Home Depot. Yoga mats also give great traction. There are some ideas for footwear here: dodgerslist.boards.net/thread/1564/footwear-harnesses-scooting-garments |
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Post by Maria & Baxter on Jun 27, 2016 3:27:09 GMT -7
Hi Marjorie..
Thanks for your reply.
Baxter is up and around and walking on his leg,though not 100%.I've noticed the leg twitches now..so he has 3 wonky legs.He has always had a problem with his front left leg..he has a degeneration defect (the specialist wanted to do a knee replacement years ago) His other front leg never fully recovered after his surgery in February..it's sometimes a little slow and tucks under.His other 2 back legs are generally weak as he has Cushings Disease also.I will be taking him back to his specialist as I have noticed he isn't walking as well as he has been..he is 4 months post op and is going well,but to me he has slowed down a lot.I feel that because he is kept mostly indoors now,he doesn't get the exercise he once did.Being indoors and sliding around I think he has lost muscle mass.He does have Paws boots but he trips over them and I think that may cause injury too.I took him to the doggie park 2 weeks ago,and he loved it..he only walked at his own pace..not for long,and then he limped and was sore for the next 2 days.We haven't been out since then.We'll see what his specialist has to say.
I wouldn't put anything on his paws that I haven't double checked the ingredients.He loves to lick his paws so I'll be checking.I just thought if it was safe for humans it would be good for animals,but of course I have to take into consideration that it may taste irresistible!! We have a few non slip mats around,only he tends to walk around them..not sure if he doesn't like the feel of them on his feet..he is OK in the rugs.
I'm sure I'll find something natural and slightly tacky that will give him some grip..I'm determined :-)
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Marjorie
Moderator~
Member since 2011. Surgery & Conservative
Posts: 5,724
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Post by Marjorie on Jun 27, 2016 4:53:55 GMT -7
I'm glad you're going to take Baxter to the specialist to be checked out, Maria, even though he's walking on his leg. Any time there is any suspicion that another disc has been damaged, it's always prudent to have your dog examined to be sure.
Is the reason he's kept mostly inside now due to his IVDD? Exercise is very important for a dog with IVDD to help strengthen the muscles supporting the spine and is also important for a dog with arthritis to help keep the joints limber. If he's unstable when walking, you would need to use a sling to support his hind end.
Please let us know what the specialist says after his exam. |
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Post by Maria & Baxter on Jun 28, 2016 3:31:18 GMT -7
Hi Marjorie..
Baxter's specialist will be seeing him on Thursday..couldn't get him in any earlier.
The reason Baxter is keep indoors most of the time is partly because of his IVDD.I used to take him to the off leash dog park often,but now I can't risk him being knocked over by bigger the dogs.
He was walking quite well,but I think the cold weather here has really affected him this year,especially after surgery.
I have another dog who is a very very sprightly foxy..he's 14.He runs and carries on in the yard,and unfortunately Baxter tries to keep up with him thus tripping over and face planting.The last time he hit hard and limped for days after..I'm trying not to keep him in cotton wool,but I cringe every time he tries to run. When it was warmer he was outside for short periods but now that it's cold(I'm in Australia) he's really only going out to potty..and to do the washing line with me.
I've noticed he has lost a lot of muscle..he was always a chunky boy..now he's not.
I think I will be getting his hind harness out for support.
Will keep you posted.
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PaulaM
Moderator.
Member since 2007: surgery, conservative . Montana, USA
Posts: 19,528
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Post by PaulaM on Jun 29, 2016 9:54:06 GMT -7
Hi Maria, I read your post over on the Living with Fear dodgerslist.boards.net/thread/410/living-fear-ivdd do let us know for the time being until you see the specialist this Thursday, Baxter remains in his recovery suite until you know for sure you are not dealing with a new disc episode. How is he today, still not wanting to bear weight (pain) on back leg? It is good to keep in mind that dogs regulate their temperature through the paws. Putting stuff (wax or whatever) is gunking up the pores on the pads and not doing a dog any favors. The sticky stuff will attract all kinds of hair and dirt sticking to the paws. The better ideas is to provide traction in your home with rug runners over smooth floors such as tile or wood. One of our members used " Toe Grips" with good success...that might be something to try out? discussion is here: dodgerslist.boards.net/thread/1564/footwear-harnesses-scooting-garmentsUntil Baxter regains full control over his legs, until the nerves and the muscles have good communication, muscles have regained good strength, smooth floors are a problem tractionwise. If this Thursday's vet visit turns out to not be a disc episode and no need of being in a recovery suite, see what ways you can continue PT at home every day to try to exercise and provide stimulation for the 3 legs that are wonky. Outdoors you could walk him slowly up and down a gentle slope, back and forth across the slope. Have him walk in high grass so he will likely lift his paws higher, across sand, and other textures to provide stimulative sensation for his paws etc. Indoors you might try putting down a couple of brooms, so he has to lift his paws a bit higher to step over the handles as you walk him on carpet/rug runners. Have him do sit to stands and reverse stand to a sit. Standing to lying down and reverse that. All in an effort to exercise and strengthen those muscles. Your physio person, may be able to offer you other ideas for at home PT. |
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Post by Maria & Baxter on Jun 29, 2016 20:25:24 GMT -7
Well we have some semi good news.
Baxter has torn a cruciate ligament.He never ran or jumped but it can happen at anytime apparently.
The specialist said it was not related to IVDD..which I suppose is fantastic news.
We were given 3 choices one conservative and 2 surgery.
We are going for the conservative to start as we are concerned that because his front 2 legs are not 100% the surgery will be a lot of staring on his one good leg.
We've been to the physio who has given Baxter exercises and we will be going to water therapy.
They did say they were concerned about his slipping on the floor boards so I'm off to buy some more ugly rubber mats LOL
I'll keep you posted.
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Marjorie
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Member since 2011. Surgery & Conservative
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Post by Marjorie on Jun 30, 2016 4:18:10 GMT -7
I'm glad to hear that it isn't another disc episode, Maria, and do hope that Baxter will heal well with conservative care. I think you made a very good decision to try the less invasive treatment first.
Healing prayers for Baxter.
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Post by Maria & Baxter on Sept 23, 2016 1:08:54 GMT -7
Thanks Marjorie..I'm so relieved.
Thanks for all of your advice..I really appreciate it
Hi everyone...I thought I would give an update on Baxter.
It has now been 7 months since Baxter had his surgery. He is doing fantastic.
The house now has some fancy permanent runners made of carpet for him and he knows they are for him,and feels confident to run a little on them.
He now also sports some Toe Grips,which whilst he didn't like them being put on,they do seem to provide him with a little more grip.
His permanent ban on jumping on any furniture,bed or going up and down the stairs is still well and truly in place.He knows to wait at the foot of the stairs for someone to pick him up.
He has been going to fortnightly water therapy..which he doesn't really love,but he has gained muscle mass since he has started on his rear legs.I never had the cruciate surgery the specialist recommended but his physio that takes him for water therapy has been working on movement with him.
His front leg that was knuckling under still occasionally does that but it doesn't seem to bother him.
Overall he is a happy little boy who loves his toys still at 12 yrs of age...and loves his food...we are still working on getting his few extra winter weight pounds off.
I guess what I have learnt from DodgersList is that crate rest is imperative..and after surgery management needs to be maintained.I wish now I'd put the non slip mats down sooner for him,as I think he would have gained muscle and strength sooner.
Thanks so much everyone for your help.
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Marjorie
Moderator~
Member since 2011. Surgery & Conservative
Posts: 5,724
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Post by Marjorie on Sept 23, 2016 4:14:39 GMT -7
So glad to hear how well Baxter is doing, Maria. He's a real little trooper and he has a great advocate in you. Thanks so much for the update!
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PaulaM
Moderator.
Member since 2007: surgery, conservative . Montana, USA
Posts: 19,528
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Post by PaulaM on Sept 23, 2016 11:05:00 GMT -7
Maria, I am also glad to read your update...we LOVE updates as the months, years pass.
Thank you for feedback on the toe grips and the usefulness of rug runners. So good to hear Baxter is living and loving life at 12!
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